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                <text>Cache&#13;
Valley&#13;
Refugee&#13;
Oral&#13;
History&#13;
Project:&#13;
Tun&#13;
Lay&#13;
Page&#13;
1&#13;
CACHE VALLEY REFUGEE ORAL HISTORY PROJECT&#13;
TRANSCRIPTION COVER SHEET&#13;
Interviewee: Tun Lay&#13;
Present: Tun Lay, Bethany Hanks, Chit Moe, Wes Van de Water, Meagan Gill&#13;
Place of Interview: Tun Lay’s home in Logan, Utah&#13;
Date of Interview: May 16, 2015&#13;
Language(s): Pwo Karen; English&#13;
Translation:&#13;
Interviewer: Bethany Hanks&#13;
Interpreter: Chit Moe&#13;
Recordist: Wes Van de Water&#13;
Photographer: Meagan Gill&#13;
Recording Equipment: Tascam DR-100mk11 linear PCM recorder; Senal ENG-18RL&#13;
broadcast-quality omnidirectional dynamic microphone&#13;
Transcription Equipment: Express Scribe with PowerPlayer foot pedal.&#13;
Transcribed by: Susan Gross, May 17, 2015&#13;
Transcript Proofed by: Bethany Hanks, May 18, 2015&#13;
Brief Description of Contents: Tun Lay describes his life as a Karen refugee. He talks about&#13;
his life in Burma during war, and the hardships placed on him by the Burmese military in trying&#13;
to earn a living as a farmer. He explains how he escaped from Burma to Thailand refugee camps,&#13;
and how he eventual brought his wife and child to live with him there. Tun Lay recounts his&#13;
experiences in various refugee camps (including fleeing villages burned by Burmese military, his&#13;
religious path, and family), and also how he eventually came to the United States (first Salt Lake&#13;
City, Utah; followed by Logan, Utah). He discusses how he came to live in Cache Valley, Utah,&#13;
and how he has adjusted to living and working in the United States.&#13;
Reference: BH = Bethany Hanks&#13;
BHI = Bethany Hanks’ words interpreted by translator&#13;
TL = Tun Lay&#13;
TLI = Tun Lay’s words interpreted by translator&#13;
WV = Wes Van de Water&#13;
WVI = Wes Van de Water’s words interpreted by translator&#13;
MG = Meagan Gill&#13;
MGI = Meagan Gill’s words interpreted by translator&#13;
Cache&#13;
Valley&#13;
Refugee&#13;
Oral&#13;
History&#13;
Project:&#13;
Tun&#13;
Lay&#13;
Page&#13;
2&#13;
NOTE: Interjections during pauses or transitions in dialogue such as “uh” and false starts and&#13;
stops in conversations are not included in transcribed. All additions to transcript are noted with&#13;
brackets.&#13;
TAPE TRANSCRIPTION&#13;
[00:01]&#13;
BH: Okay. Today is May 16, 2015, and this is Bethany Hanks with Wes Van de Water and&#13;
Meagan Gill. We are students at Utah State University, and we are working on a project&#13;
called “Voices: Refugees in Cache Valley.” Right now we are visiting Tun Lay in his&#13;
home, in Logan, Utah, and Chit Moe is our translator.&#13;
So, first of all thank you, Tun Lay, for letting us come here into your home.&#13;
BHI: [Repeating statement in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
BH: First, I would like to know what is your full name, and your birth year?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: My name is Tun Lay and I was born in 1958.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Oh, 1954. I’m sorry, 1954.&#13;
BH: Okay. Thank you.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: And May 28th, 1954.&#13;
BH: Okay, thank you. And what languages do you speak?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: He speaks Karen, Pwo Karen and Burmese, but right now we are speaking Pwo Karen.&#13;
BH: Okay; so not Burmese?&#13;
Cache&#13;
Valley&#13;
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TLI: No, it’s not Burmese.&#13;
BH: Okay; very cool. Can you tell me about your family?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Yes.&#13;
BH: So, do you have other family members?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: He has a family here, but not relatives.&#13;
BH: Oh, okay. So you have family here, but not relatives? So like you have a brother and&#13;
sister, or I don’t know if I quite understand?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: I have a wife [laughs] –&#13;
BH: Oh, okay.&#13;
TLI: And three children – one is married (and he is in Arizona), and the other two live with&#13;
me.&#13;
BH: Wow, so they live here?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Yes, two live with him, and the other one is in Arizona.&#13;
BH: Okay. Were your children – were they born here?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating the question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
Cache&#13;
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Refugee&#13;
Oral&#13;
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TLI: No, none.&#13;
BH: None? Where did you live before?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating the question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Before I was in Burma in the city called Tun Aung; the name of the city is Tun Aung.&#13;
[Translator speaking to interviewer] Should I spell it?&#13;
BH: Yeah, how do you spell that?&#13;
TLI: Tun Aung (I think): T-U-N A-U-N-G. Tun Aung.&#13;
[Translator speaking to interviewee in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: P-U, actually. It’s P-U.&#13;
BH: P-U-N?&#13;
TLI: No, just P-U.&#13;
BH: Oh, just P-U?&#13;
[04:02]&#13;
TLI: Pu Aung.&#13;
BH: Pu Aung.&#13;
TLI: That’s the name of the city.&#13;
BH: Wow. Can you tell me a little about this city?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Ever since I was born in that city, I grew up; when I got old I married to my wife, then&#13;
we moved to Thailand and now we’re in America. But I can tell you step by step of the&#13;
process of what I’ve been through.&#13;
BH: I would love to hear, step by step, the process.&#13;
Cache&#13;
Valley&#13;
Refugee&#13;
Oral&#13;
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BHI: [Repeating remark in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Yeah, he is going to explain it step by step.&#13;
BH: Okay.&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So when I got married I had one kid.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So my occupation was being a farmer and raising cows and other animals.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Me living in the United States, there are difficulties here.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Oh, it’s still in Burma, actually (my mistake).&#13;
BH: In Burma?&#13;
TLI: Yeah. So we faced difficulties in Pu Aung, in Burma.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So in Burma there are difficulties, meaning we were in fear of Burmese military, and we&#13;
couldn’t do work freely.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So between Burmese military and the Karen military, they were in war and we were&#13;
really scared.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So we couldn’t do our work when there was a war because the Burmese military would&#13;
come to our village and take us as porters – you know, forcing us to do work for them.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
Cache&#13;
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TLI: So if they couldn’t find us, they would go to our work place and kind of drag us to where&#13;
they wanted to take us; if not, they would come at night and just force us – just drag us&#13;
out of our house.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Living there was really difficult, and I couldn’t do any work; so moving around and I&#13;
ended up in Thailand.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: I was just following strangers, being stranded, and that’s how I got to Thailand.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So living in Thailand many, many years I have learned and found the U.N., which is a&#13;
great organization which helps the refugees: they give food and shelter.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
[08:39]&#13;
TLI: So from what I see from what I learned, I wanted my wife to come to Thailand in a&#13;
refugee camp. So I started telling her to do the same process, you know, asking strangers&#13;
for a ride, being stranded; and that’s how she also got to a Thailand refugee camp.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So living there many, many years I had two children.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So living there for many, many years again, we were given like a photo ID for living in a&#13;
refugee camp (like a permanent resident thing).&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: [Responding to interviewee in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So after a few years we learned that the UN were telling people that they could go to&#13;
other countries (like United States, Australia). And then they told us that we had to fill&#13;
out an application, and we did it.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
Cache&#13;
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Oral&#13;
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TLI: So many people in a refugee camp came to such other countries, and I was also one of&#13;
them.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So in June it will be –&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: In June 11th of this year it will be –&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: It will be seven years of my family living in Utah, in the United States.&#13;
BH: Wow.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Living here is very, very peaceful, happy for me and my family; I have work, I have&#13;
food, I mean, there is nothing to worry about (like being free, peaceful), you know, being&#13;
free.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: I am very, very happy, and I am very glad I am in this state and in this country.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So everything I was born living in Burma was really difficult, and there was many&#13;
difficulties; and there are many, many things that I have faced that I just can’t talk about&#13;
it all at the same time because there are just many, many difficulties.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: And my family and I are very, very thankful to the UN, which they provided us food and&#13;
shelter; we are very, very thankful to them.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Yeah, being in Utah is the same thing: many people help us out, you know, getting us a&#13;
house (for example), and yeah –&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
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TLI: So when I first came to the United States I was in Salt Lake for a year, and now I am in&#13;
Logan for almost six years.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
[12:25]&#13;
TLI: And I am very happy for being in Logan, and I have a job in JBS, and I have worked&#13;
there for almost seven years.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Just like that.&#13;
BH: Wow. So you mentioned going from Burma to Thailand, and it sounds like you would&#13;
take rides from strangers. Can you describe a little bit more about maybe what the&#13;
journey was like going from Burma to Thailand?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So number one key is between Burma and Thailand, there were a lot of people who were&#13;
like transporter (I would say): they would do business across each country –&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Okay, some people would hire other people – I mean, some people would go to Thailand,&#13;
buy a lot of food, and then they would hire people and take it back to Burma and sell it&#13;
there.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: I was one of the people who got hired. I was carrying bags, you know, back and forth and&#13;
that’s how I got to Thailand.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: And when I got to Thailand I saw Thai people, you know, they were hiring people to do&#13;
work, and I was one of the workers in there as well.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So from there, working there for a few months – as I was crossing from Thailand to&#13;
Burma, I saw a refugee camp (which I also heard about it), and that’s when I started&#13;
going to the refugee camp asking people, maybe to see if there is anyone I know, and&#13;
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people were telling me that, “It’s better here,” you know, “we have food; we are stuffed.&#13;
You should come and live over here.”&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: And that’s when I tell my wife and my child to also come up to the refugee camp to live&#13;
with me.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: And living there many, many years – that’s when that organization, they were you know,&#13;
taking applications; and that’s how I got here.&#13;
BH: Okay; wow. After you fill out an application, is it difficult to get into the camp – the&#13;
refugee camp?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating the question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
[16:16]&#13;
TLI: So there was no application to get to the refugee camp. What you do is that you go talk to&#13;
– so in the refugee camp there is a certain section where they put you in – you just go talk&#13;
to the leader, just talk to him or her, and then he would like take you to another person&#13;
who is like the leader for the whole camp. And then that’s when you started telling your&#13;
story, and that’s when they can tell whether you’re lying, or whether you’re telling the&#13;
truth and how difficult your life was; and that’s how they accept me to live in the camp.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So why they were asking me questions, you know, how my life was, I have to tell the&#13;
truth and later on they would have to, you know, figure out whether that’s the truth or&#13;
not. If it’s true, then they let me live in there; if not, then no.&#13;
BH: Okay. Was it difficult for your wife and your child to also come over?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating the question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: [Speaking to interviewee in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
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TLI: There was no difficulty for my wife and child to come to the refugee camp because I was&#13;
already there, and all I had to do was tell the leader – tell him that my wife is coming, and&#13;
he would be like, “Okay, that’s fine.” But the difficulty was for my wife and child to get&#13;
to the refugee camp – that was one of the difficulties. Because fortunately my wife speaks&#13;
Burmese, so sometimes she would speak in Burmese and people would think, “Oh, she’s&#13;
Burmese, just let her go.” And sometimes the military would think that, “Oh, this is a&#13;
very pitiful family, just let them go.” And that’s how they got to the refugee camp.&#13;
BH: Wow.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
[Tun Lay’s daughter and one of his sons enter the room. His daughter greets everyone.]&#13;
BH: Hello.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So for me and my family, on my way to the refugee camp, we have met with Karen&#13;
military, and they were very nice, very generous; they helped us –&#13;
[Tun Lay’s daughter drops something on the floor; she apologizes.]&#13;
TLI: You know, they help us get to another place and they were really nice.&#13;
BH: Okay. So was it dangerous at all – that trip from Burma to Thailand? I’m just wondering&#13;
if – because it sounds like you rely a lot on strangers – is that difficult to do, is that scary?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating the question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
[19:56]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So one thing is that once you reach the border between Burma and Thailand, it’s easier –&#13;
you can just walk to the refugee camp with nothing to worry about.&#13;
BH: Okay.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Once you reach Thailand border – you can either walk there or take a ride from the Thai&#13;
military, and you can just pay them $5 or $10.&#13;
BH: Wow. So can you describe for me a little what your surroundings were in the refugee&#13;
camp – like what it looked like?&#13;
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BHI: [Repeating the question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So when I was in the refugee camp there was a city called Kue Bong [??] (I don’t know&#13;
how to spell that), but Kue Bong –&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So you know, like I said, there was a city really close to the refugee camp; in that camp –&#13;
we lived there for a few years, and then Burmese military were coming and they burned&#13;
the whole village down.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: And then we started, after the Burmese military were coming to burn our refugee camp,&#13;
we moved to another camp, which is called –&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: [Speaking to the interviewee in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Kue Bong was the first refugee camp that I was in, and after a few years the Burmese&#13;
military were coming, burned down the village; and then I got to another town which is&#13;
called –&#13;
[Speaking to interviewee in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Kwe Ka Lu [??]&#13;
TL: Kwe Ka Lu&#13;
TLI: Kwe Ka Lu. K-something. Got it?&#13;
BH: Kwe Ka Lu&#13;
TLI: Um-hmm.&#13;
[Speaking to interviewee in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
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TLI: And living there for one and a half years, the Burmese military were there again, and they&#13;
burned the village down and we started –&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So after when the Burmese military were coming and, you know, burning the village&#13;
down we got help from the UN. They took us over the mountains, and we started living&#13;
on a mountain – it’s called Umpium camp right now. A lot of Karen people were there as&#13;
well; it is on a mountain.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So I can still remember the year that I got to the Umpium camp – it was 1999.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So starting from 1999, I lived in the Umpium camp all the way until 2008; and that’s&#13;
when I started coming to the United States.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: June 11th, 2008, was the date I departed from the refugee camp.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: And I lived in Salt Lake for one year, and now I’m here in Logan for six years.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Yep, that’s pretty much it.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Living here is really a good thing for me, you know; you can go anywhere you want, you&#13;
have a job. I’m really happy.&#13;
[24:40]&#13;
BH: That’s good. Let’s see – so can you tell me a little about your first months here, in the&#13;
United States; and maybe the problems and the difficulties, but maybe also the good&#13;
things that you saw?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating the question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
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TLI: When I first arrived in the United States my family, we were put in a house (like in an&#13;
apartment), and people were saying, “Later on, if you guys cannot pay the rent, you guys&#13;
will be kicked out.” And we were really worried, you know, and that was one of the fears&#13;
that we had in our first month. And after a few months we had to do like a community&#13;
service at CCS (in Salt Lake) where we had to go and give food to the people (I think&#13;
they are the homeless, I think that’s the service). And after a few months I heard about&#13;
the JBS and I came here, got a job, and that’s when I asked my family to move here.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: [Speaking to interviewee in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So you know, in that first month there wasn’t a lot to do; but on the second month, like I&#13;
said, I had to do service at CCS (it was fun), and I had to do it two days a week, and the&#13;
other two days was me going to school to learn English.&#13;
[27:59]&#13;
BH: Wow. So when you came to the United States, did you have any prior knowledge of&#13;
English?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: No, not at all; my wife, my children – nobody knows English.&#13;
BH: Wow.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: And I only know how to read Burmese, specifically.&#13;
BH: Wow. So did that make it difficult to interact with people when you first moved here?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating the question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: It wasn’t really difficult because I was speaking with other Karen communities; and if I&#13;
wanted to talk to an English speaker we had it translated.&#13;
BH: Okay.&#13;
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TLI: So there wasn’t any difficulties.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So if we wanted to go buy groceries, we would ask someone who came here before us,&#13;
you know, who has a car – and we would ask them to take us to buy food, groceries.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: [Speaking to interviewee in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So if we needed help with anything we would go to IRC (it’s also in Salt Lake) and they&#13;
have translators over there, you know; they have people that can help you with what you&#13;
need.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Like I said, if we need help we can go to IRC, CCS or another place – it’s called DWS&#13;
(it’s Department of Workforce Services); and they also have translators over there, you&#13;
know. We would like ask someone who came before us to take us over there, or&#13;
sometimes DWS will come and pick us up personally.&#13;
BH: Wow.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So everybody surrounding me here – like all the Americans – they were really nice; they&#13;
helped us in many ways.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: And that is why I am living here really happy, my family is really happy.&#13;
BH: That’s good.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
BH: So the reason why you moved to Logan was to work at JBS?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating the question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
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TLI: Yes, that is correct.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So you know, when I was hired at JBS I worked there for one year. And then after that I&#13;
went back to Salt Lake and I told my family to move with me to Logan, in this apartment&#13;
(this house), and I haven’t moved ever since.&#13;
BH: Wow. So I wonder if you could describe for me sort of the differences in food? Maybe&#13;
some things that you used to eat in Burma, that maybe you can’t find here, or maybe you&#13;
can? Maybe just a little bit about the food of your culture.&#13;
BHI: [Repeating the question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So I have no problem eating American food here – it’s better than what I used to eat back&#13;
there.&#13;
BH: Okay.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Yeah, there are more food here than back in the refugee camp.&#13;
BH: So what kind of food was available in the refugee camp?&#13;
[33:06]&#13;
BHI: [Repeating question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: There are many, many foods. One is rice – they gave us oil, and beans, and –&#13;
[Speaking to interviewee in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: And peppers – chili; yeah, a lot of food – like food that is very sufficient for each family.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: They gave us food like once a month.&#13;
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BH: Okay. So what kinds of food do you like to eat now that you’re here, in the United&#13;
States?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: He said there are many; there is a lot of food in America (like chicken, fish) – I just, I like&#13;
everything.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.] [Laughs]&#13;
TLI: There are a lot of food, like – yeah, I just like everything.&#13;
BH: Okay. So I wanted to ask how people respond when they find out you’re from Burma? I&#13;
know you said in Salt Lake the people were really friendly, and so I just want to see if&#13;
that’s still the case, or if people respond differently?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating the question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So when I got to the United States, I mean even when someone asked me where I’m&#13;
from, “Burma.”&#13;
“Yeah, okay.” There wasn’t any negative thing.&#13;
BH: Okay, that’s good. Can you tell me a little about your home here, and how it’s different&#13;
from your home in Burma?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So it’s really different here, houses – to describe it, it’s perfect, you know. But in Burma&#13;
it’s very different, you have to build your own home; you have to use like bamboo to&#13;
build it. And you have to make your own walls, but they’re not tight walls and wind can&#13;
go through any time. It was really different from here.&#13;
BH: Wow. What would you like people in Logan to know about you, or your family, or your&#13;
ethnic group?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating the question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
[37:22]&#13;
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TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: He is not very clear on the question.&#13;
BH: Let’s see if I can ask it a different way. Is there anything that you would like to share with&#13;
the people around here that maybe they don’t know, or you wish they knew?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating the question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So I have a different message, you know: I want people to know – before that, I believe&#13;
in God, and I want people to know that one day everybody will have a chance to live in&#13;
heaven.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: [Speaking to interviewee in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So I kind of asked him to make sure he understand that question, and –&#13;
BH: Um-hmm?&#13;
TLI: He said that there isn’t anything that he really wants to share because he feels that other&#13;
people, you know, (other American people) I’m sure they have faced many difficulty as&#13;
well (getting here) – maybe back in the day or something. So it’s probably the same&#13;
story.&#13;
BH: Okay. Would you ever be interested in going back to Burma?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating the question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: I’m very happy here. I do feel like going back, but I don’t want to go back because my&#13;
parents, my brothers – I don’t know where they are; in Burma, I don’t know where&#13;
they’re at and I don’t want to go back.&#13;
BH: Okay. What are you most proud of?&#13;
TLI: Here, or?&#13;
BH: Yeah, I would say what are you most proud of out of all of this: your experiences and&#13;
traveling?&#13;
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BHI: [Repeating the question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: I’m very proud, you know, to live each day being healthy and being happy day after day.&#13;
So yeah, that’s what I’m really proud of.&#13;
[41:20]&#13;
BH: Thank you. And do you have any dreams for the future – either for yourself, or for your&#13;
children?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating the question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: For me, my family, my children, my family, my wife – for my family – I don’t have any&#13;
dreams for us, but I do believe in God and I pray for us (for me and for my family) you&#13;
know, to be healthy, to stay happy. Yeah.&#13;
BH: Okay. I think those are all of my questions. But before we end, I just want to see if any of&#13;
my colleagues have one as well.&#13;
BHI: [Repeating statement in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Yeah, you guys can ask questions.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: If I know the answer, I will answer it; but if I don’t, I don’t.&#13;
WV: I’m just kind of curious who plays the guitar in the family – is that yours?&#13;
WVI: [Repeating the question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Yeah, I used to – every Sunday when I pray with my family – I used to play the guitar&#13;
every Sunday.&#13;
WV: Nice.&#13;
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TLI: According to my religion, my Bible, it said that when you’re praying, you know, when&#13;
you’re praying and asking for God’s help, you must play a song (you know, play with the&#13;
guitar).&#13;
BH: Wow.&#13;
TLI: And so I’m doing it every Sunday.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: I believe that – I know that we can’t see God, but I know God can help us in a way.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: And how do I know this is because I am very healthy every day, and I have been doing&#13;
work here for almost seven years and I am very healthy – and I know that God is helping&#13;
me.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: And at the same time I want to tell people that God is helping us, but if they want to&#13;
listen, then I can tell them; if you don’t want to listen, then I don’t have to tell them.&#13;
BH: Do you have any questions?&#13;
MG: Yeah. What is your favorite thing about Cache Valley? What is your favorite thing to do&#13;
here?&#13;
MGI: [Repeating question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: He doesn’t know what his favorite thing is. Is there an example you can give?&#13;
MG: Hiking, camping –&#13;
MGI: [Repeating statement in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
[45:37]&#13;
TLI: No, I haven’t done that – hiking or camping; I’ve just been driving around the city, going&#13;
back to Salt Lake and eating at restaurants sometimes.&#13;
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TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.] [Laughs]&#13;
TLI: Yeah, I’ve never been hiking.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: But I would like to go one day.&#13;
BH: So actually, I thought of a couple more questions – if that’s okay?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Yeah, that’s fine.&#13;
TL: [Laughs]&#13;
BH: Okay. So you mentioned the guitar, and playing music is an important part of your&#13;
religious observance – so I was just wondering if you could kind of describe your&#13;
religious community; sort of, things about your religion?&#13;
BHI: Community?&#13;
BH: Yeah&#13;
BHI: [Repeating question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: I know that every religion has different beliefs, and there are different ways how you can&#13;
pray to God; but my way is I read the Bible every day, and that’s how I understand God’s&#13;
word. I remember when I was in the refugee camp, you know, and living there for eight&#13;
years, I was going around to different religions, you know, listening to people giving&#13;
speeches. One day I met this priest, you know, he taught me many valuable things, and he&#13;
even asked me to be an heir priest – is that how you say it? Well, yeah.&#13;
BH: Like an apprentice?&#13;
TLI: Well to become the next priest.&#13;
BH: Okay; to be like the replacement after him?&#13;
TLI: Yes, yes. Yeah, he even asked me to become that – or if he has to go somewhere else,&#13;
you know, I’d be taking his position to do all the religious things in the church. Yeah.&#13;
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TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So there are lots of gods; Americans call him Jesus, but the thing is you need to know&#13;
which one is real, you know, which one is the real God.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So whether there are many gods, or just one God – if anybody want to listen, I can tell&#13;
them the story.&#13;
BH: If you want to share.&#13;
BHI: [Repeating statement in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So there is only one God that I believe in, you know; he cannot be sick, or he can heal –&#13;
he can get all or any other things. Before anybody (any human being) exists, he lived here&#13;
before, and he created the Earth, trees, everything.&#13;
[50:20]&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Another type of God is who can die, who heals, and it is called –&#13;
[Speaking to interviewee in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: And in Burmese it is called [Pwo Karen word]&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: And the easier way to say is Pe Synga Piya[??]&#13;
BH: Pe Synga –&#13;
TLI: Piya. Pe Synga Piya. Yeah.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: And he is a God that can die, and you know, and can’t heal people. And he is the God&#13;
that the particular God created. Do you understand that?&#13;
BH: He would –&#13;
Cache&#13;
Valley&#13;
Refugee&#13;
Oral&#13;
History&#13;
Project:&#13;
Tun&#13;
Lay&#13;
Page&#13;
22&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So the one person God – he created another person who is also God, but he can die.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: If it’s God Jesus – there is only one Jesus.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: And he is everybody – for everybody’s God.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: He can’t die, you know, he can’t get old – he is the only one.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: There is a guarantee, you know, that if anybody believe that there is God, that one&#13;
particular person will be in heaven.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So if you believe God, you know, you have to follow his words; you have to read the&#13;
Bible, you have to do what the Bible says.&#13;
BH: So I have just one more question.&#13;
BHI: [Repeating statement in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: That’s fine.&#13;
BH: You seem very interested in religion, and so I was wondering if that was a part of your&#13;
life before you came to the refugee camp, or if that’s something that you really became&#13;
interested in once you got to the refugee camps?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
[53:11]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
Cache&#13;
Valley&#13;
Refugee&#13;
Oral&#13;
History&#13;
Project:&#13;
Tun&#13;
Lay&#13;
Page&#13;
23&#13;
TLI: So I was really, really interested in God in the year 1999, and that was when I got to the&#13;
refugee camp called Umpium; and that was when I was really interested in religion.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: So in the refugee camp there are a lot of people who just go around the camp, you know,&#13;
telling stories, sharing God’s word, you know.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: And I would go all over the place to listen to their speeches, you know; it can be night, or&#13;
it can be day.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Why I wanted to know that is because I believe God is good, and you know –&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: And you know, like I say, I started listening to those speeches every day, and that’s&#13;
where I learned knowledge, you know, about religion.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: And I understood a lot of words that – well, the speakers’ word.&#13;
TL: [Laughs]&#13;
BH: Very neat. So there were not very many people in Burma who spoke of these different&#13;
religions? I guess I’m just wondering why it was so prevalent in the refugee camp – was&#13;
it the same way in Burma?&#13;
BHI: [Repeating question in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: No; I didn’t see any in Burma.&#13;
BH: Wow.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Yeah, I started seeing it in the refugee camp.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
Cache&#13;
Valley&#13;
Refugee&#13;
Oral&#13;
History&#13;
Project:&#13;
Tun&#13;
Lay&#13;
Page&#13;
24&#13;
TLI: So when I was in Burma, I heard of such religions, but I had never seen it.&#13;
BH: Okay.&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: When I first got to the refugee camp, you know, I was asked, “Do you know God? Do&#13;
you know the real one, you know, the one that can heal, the one that can’t get old?” So&#13;
I’m like, “Well God is good, so yes – I want to know.”&#13;
TL: [Speaking in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: And now that I know a lot about God, you know, I do want to share it with people, to&#13;
those who want to listen; but if you don’t want to listen, that’s okay.&#13;
BH: So I think we are almost out of time, unfortunately – because we only have so much time&#13;
that we can record on here. But it has been fascinating to listen to you.&#13;
BHI: [Repeating statement in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.] [Laughs]&#13;
TLI: Thank you.&#13;
BH: Thank you very much.&#13;
BHI: [Repeating in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TL: [Responding in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
TLI: Thank you.&#13;
BH: So I think that’s the end of the interview.&#13;
BHI: [Repeating statement in Pwo Karen.]&#13;
[End recording – 57:20]</text>
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CACHE VALLEY REFUGEE ORAL HISTORY PROJECT&#13;
TRANSCRIPTION COVER SHEET&#13;
Interviewee: Pyo Nwe&#13;
Present: Pyo Nwe, Bethany Hanks, Chit Moe, Wes Van de Water, Meagan&#13;
Gill&#13;
Place of Interview: Pyo Nwe’s home in Logan, Utah&#13;
Date of Interview: May 18, 2015&#13;
Language(s): Karen; English&#13;
Translation:&#13;
Interviewer: Bethany Hanks&#13;
Interpreter: Chit Moe&#13;
Recordist: Wes Van de Water&#13;
Photographer: Meagan Gill&#13;
Recording Equipment: Tascam DR-100mk11 linear PCM recorder; Senal ENG-&#13;
18RL broadcast-quality omnidirectional dynamic&#13;
microphone&#13;
Transcription Equipment: Express Scribe&#13;
Transcribed by: Bethany Hanks, May 24, 2015&#13;
Transcript Proofed by: Bethany Hanks, May 25, 2015&#13;
Brief Description of Contents: Pyo Nwe describes her life in a Karen refugee camp&#13;
before she came to the United States. She explains what brought her to the Karen refugee&#13;
camp and what it was like living there, getting married there, and having children there.&#13;
She also describes the changes and difficulties that she and her family faced (and still&#13;
face) when they left the refugee camp and came to the United States.&#13;
Reference: BH = Bethany Hanks&#13;
BHI = Bethany Hanks interpreted by translator&#13;
PN = Pyo Nwe&#13;
PNI = Pyo Nwe interpreted by translator&#13;
WV = Wes Van de Water&#13;
WVI = Wes Van de Water interpreted by translator&#13;
Cache&#13;
Valley&#13;
Refugee&#13;
Oral&#13;
History&#13;
Project:&#13;
Pyo&#13;
Nwe&#13;
Page&#13;
2&#13;
NOTE: Interjections during pauses or transitions in dialogue such as “uh” and false&#13;
starts and stops in conversations are not included in transcribed. All additions to&#13;
transcript are noted with brackets.&#13;
TAPE TRANSCRIPTION&#13;
[00:01]&#13;
BH: Okay, today is May 18, 2015. And this is Bethany Hanks with Wes Van de Water&#13;
on audio and Meagan Gill taking photographs. We’re all students at Utah State&#13;
University and are working on a project called “Voices: Refugees in Cache&#13;
Valley.” Right now we’re visiting Pyo Nwe at her home in Logan, Utah. And her&#13;
little son is with us, who is 8 months old, and Chit Moe is translating.&#13;
So, first we want to thank you Pyo Nwe for letting us come and speak with you.&#13;
So first, um, can I have you say your full name and birth year?&#13;
PN: Pyo Nwe Nwe&#13;
BH: Pyo Nwe Nwe?&#13;
PN: January 1st, 1978.&#13;
BH: Thank you.&#13;
PNI: Date of birth, January 1st, 1978.&#13;
BH: Okay, thank you. And what languages do you speak?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [laughs]&#13;
[responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: I speak Karen and Burmese.&#13;
BH: Thank you. Can you tell me a little about your family?&#13;
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BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: In Utah, or?&#13;
BH: Um, if you can talk about maybe your family here in Utah and also if you have&#13;
family over in Karen too?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
[2:07]&#13;
[Baby breathing loudly]&#13;
PNI: Um, my family, we all lived in refugee camps and then we all moved to Utah,&#13;
which is, we were in Salt Lake and we came in March 3rd, 2008.&#13;
[2:25]&#13;
[Baby makes noises]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: We lived there for one year in Salt Lake City, and we moved here in 2009, and&#13;
we’ve been here ever since.&#13;
BH: He likes the microphone, doesn’t he?&#13;
[laughs]&#13;
So the refugee camp where you were at – where was that exactly?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: It is called Mela Camp.&#13;
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BH: Mela Camp? And do you have any idea where the location of that is in Thailand?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: We didn’t know. It is close to the border, and I know that it’s in Thailand, but I&#13;
don’t know whether it’s the south or which states or province it’s in. We just&#13;
know that it’s a refugee camp.&#13;
BH: Okay, and did you say how long you were there for?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: 1997 to 2008.&#13;
PNI: From 1997 to 2008.&#13;
BH: Wow, so then did you grow up quite a lot in this refugee camp?&#13;
BHI: Like, did she grow up in refugee camp?&#13;
BH: Yeah, like there as a young child and maybe as a teenager.&#13;
PN: Yeah, teenager.&#13;
BH: Yeah?&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Yes, I was sixteen years old back then.&#13;
BH: Okay. What was it like for you, being there as a young person in the refugee&#13;
camp?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
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PNI: Well, at first I lived in Burma. I was poor – my family was poor, and from what I&#13;
heard, refugee is a better place than Burma. At refugee camp they have school,&#13;
and their schooling is free. So I decided to go to refugee camp for education&#13;
purposes.&#13;
BH: Okay, so what kinds of education did they offer in the refugee camp?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Well, the education in the refugee camp was – it’s not so great like in America,&#13;
but it’s better than Burma though.&#13;
[5:59]&#13;
[Baby breathes loudly]&#13;
BH: Okay, what kinds of things did you learn in the refugee camp?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: I don’t know if I learned much in the refugee camp because at first, coming to a&#13;
refugee camp was to study—&#13;
[Baby makes noises]&#13;
—but then, things changes, you know. Different circumstances occurred, and it&#13;
just changes.&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: And I didn’t get to learn.&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
[Baby makes noises]&#13;
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PNI: However, I did help out the school and the teachers with a few things; just helping&#13;
out for a few years.&#13;
BH: Okay. Did you have any brothers or sisters with you, or your parents?&#13;
PN: Yeah, [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: I have three brothers, I mean –&#13;
PN: Three sisters.&#13;
PNI: – three sisters. One is in Thailand and the other is in Burma, in Karen State.&#13;
BH: Okay, we’ll get him some toys huh; let him play.&#13;
[laughs]&#13;
So are your siblings, are they still, you said in Thailand and Burma? Are they still&#13;
over there? Yeah? So, they weren’t in the refugee camp with you? Or –&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
[8:47]&#13;
PNI: No, they didn’t live with me in the refugee camp, but my older sister (the one&#13;
that’s in Thailand) she has a daughter who has a disease, and in order to cure the&#13;
disease, there isn’t a hospital in the refugee camp. There is, but it’s not very big.&#13;
So, they had to go to Thailand to work over there and to get her daughter the cure.&#13;
BH: Do you remember much about your life before being in the refugee camp?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Yeah, a lot.&#13;
BH: Yeah? What kinds of things do you remember?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
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PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Well, I remember lots of things, but which one are you wanting to know more&#13;
about?&#13;
BH: Yeah, let’s see, I guess things about your family – maybe your daily, kind of what&#13;
life would have been like for you on just a regular day? Or maybe like the sort of&#13;
the political situation, if it was dangerous at all.&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: [speaking in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
[11:53]&#13;
PNI: Well, I do remember like from 1989 or 1990, well – not before 1990. I think I was&#13;
about 9 or 10 years old back then. We had, like I said, three sisters, and I lived&#13;
with my parents. Well, my biggest goal was to go to school you know, to have a&#13;
better school for me. Back then it was really difficult because the Burmese&#13;
military were coming and forcing people to become porters, and my dad was one&#13;
of them. After he has gone to do the porter thing, and then he lost his leg, like&#13;
during the war, and he couldn’t work any more after that. It was a really&#13;
challenging for my family. After a few months or a few days (I can’t remember)&#13;
my older sister, she kind of left us and she went to Thailand.&#13;
BH: Wow, thank you. So was education, then, I know you said – you mentioned&#13;
education earlier, and you wanted to get a better education. Were there other&#13;
reasons for relocating to the refugee camp?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Yes, I wanted to go to school like really bad back then. In my village, my family&#13;
was the poorest out of everybody, and then in order to go to school there we had&#13;
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to have like a good umbrella, good shoes, good clothes – and my parents, they&#13;
couldn’t afford to buy any of that. And I kind of felt embarrassed, I mean, to go to&#13;
school there, so I though it’d be better to go to school in a refugee camp where&#13;
everything is free, you know. But then when I got to the refugee camp, I got&#13;
married – so I didn’t really get to go to school.&#13;
BH: So you met your husband, then, in the refugee camp? What was that like? Was&#13;
that a good place, I guess, to meet lots of people?&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
[15:33]&#13;
PNI: I think it’s a good place to meet with lots of people, but back then I was kind of&#13;
young. I was still young, and I had lots of thoughts: there isn’t anyone to support&#13;
me; my family isn’t here either.&#13;
[Baby makes spitting noise]&#13;
I guess that’s how I though about getting married you know – to find my&#13;
companion who, we can maybe support each other now. It’s just the thought that&#13;
came by.&#13;
BH: Very neat. So, your husband in here with you now? Did you all come over, did&#13;
you leave the refugee camp together? Yeah?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: Yes.&#13;
BH: How difficult was it to, I guess, go through the process of coming to another&#13;
country? Was that difficult or was it fairly easy?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Well, in Burma, it’s difficult there.&#13;
[Baby rattles toy and breathes loudly for a few seconds]&#13;
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In Thailand it’s the same thing. And here it’s still difficult.&#13;
BH: Yeah?&#13;
PNI: I don’t think that’s answering your question. Everywhere is difficult.&#13;
BH: Uh-huh. So, I guess, another way to ask would be is it difficult to gain entry as a&#13;
refugee into the United States?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
[phone buzzes]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
[Baby coughs]&#13;
PN: Sorry.&#13;
BH: Oh, that’s okay.&#13;
[17:58]&#13;
[Pyo Nwe moves play set nearby]&#13;
Children like to be active, I know. I have nieces and nephews, and they’re, yeah.&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: I think it’s a fairly easy process to get to United States, you know, compared to&#13;
people who came here with visa or other things. Because we were refugees, then&#13;
it was easier.&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: To get here, we received lots of help, you know. People helped us step by step to&#13;
get here.&#13;
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BH: Okay, thank you. So in the refugee camps, did they celebrate any holidays or have&#13;
any special religious days?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Yeah, there are.&#13;
BH: Yeah, like, can you give us an example of one of those special holidays and&#13;
maybe how it was celebrated?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
[19:49]&#13;
PNI: The biggest thing would be, we have Karen New Year, and we have Burmese&#13;
New Year. For Karen New Year, in the beginning we had like a – I would say like&#13;
camp leaders, lots of leaders, you know. They will go up on the stage and just&#13;
give speeches.&#13;
BH: Wow.&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Yeah, Karen has it’s own culture, and Burmese has its own culture.&#13;
BH: So, what’s the main difference, I guess, between Karen New Year and Burmese&#13;
New Year?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Because I’m not as – I guess, I don’t have a good experience, like such leaders,&#13;
but what I can tell is that for Burmese New Year, they celebrate it on April. For&#13;
Karen, they do it on December.&#13;
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BH: Okay, so it’s mainly the time then.&#13;
[Baby coughs]&#13;
Wow. Thank you.&#13;
[baby makes noises]&#13;
So, when you were in the refugee camp, did you get any idea of what the people&#13;
in Thailand thought of the refugees in the camps?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
[Baby coughs]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Well, I don’t know about other people, but for me, you know, I was really scared&#13;
of the Thai military. Thai, yeah. Because back then if we had, say we have a&#13;
meeting, say don’t go out of the camp today, then I will never go out of the camp&#13;
because if the Thai military captures you, they will send you somewhere else.&#13;
Another example is my husband who worked outside the camp –&#13;
[Baby coughs]&#13;
He was chased by Thai military lots of times, but fortunately he escaped every&#13;
single time he was chased.&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: What makes me more scared is that when I went back to Thailand one day, I saw&#13;
the Burmese military. They were taking people, you know. They were taking&#13;
people to – I don’t know where they were taking them, but they were capturing&#13;
people, so it makes me more scared.&#13;
BH: Wow.&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
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PNI: Yeah, for me, it was really scary, but I don’t know about other people.&#13;
BH: So, is that something that happens a lot – that maybe refugees leave the camp,&#13;
they sneak out or something, and then they’re captured by Thai military and taken&#13;
somewhere else?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
[24:44]&#13;
PNI: Yeah, I think it –&#13;
[Baby bonks head]&#13;
Ooh.&#13;
BH: Oh no, is he okay?&#13;
[Baby cries]&#13;
PN: Oh.&#13;
BH: Is he okay?&#13;
[Baby cries]&#13;
Head bonk.&#13;
[baby cries]&#13;
PN: Sorry.&#13;
BH: Oh, that’s okay.&#13;
PNI: He wants to sleep now. He’s feeling sleepy. Well, I don’t know about now, but&#13;
back fourteen years ago, I would say it happened a lot because I have seen it&#13;
myself. I lived close to the Thai military gate, I guess, their area, I kind of lived&#13;
close to where they lived, and what I saw was there was this –&#13;
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[phone makes noise]&#13;
– there was this woman, I would say&#13;
[phone makes noise]&#13;
PN: [laughs]&#13;
PNI: Sorry.&#13;
BH: That’s okay&#13;
PNI: Okay, what happened was this Thai military guy – he went out, he found a&#13;
woman, he took her to the camp, not to the camp but to their place, and I lived&#13;
really close to it. And they were doing some horrible things to her, I think. I heard&#13;
the noise and everything, but I couldn’t help. I was so scared. So, I think it&#13;
happened a lot.&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Well, at the same time, not all the Thai military are bad. Some are really good&#13;
people as well. I remember when I was pregnant, I saw Thai military who was&#13;
actually helping me with stuff, you know. He bought me food, so that was really&#13;
nice.&#13;
BH: Did you had some children while you were in the refugee camp.&#13;
PN: Four.&#13;
[laughs]&#13;
BH: Four?&#13;
PNI: She has four.&#13;
BH: So, four. So, this one with you, he is number four?&#13;
PN: Five.&#13;
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BH: Number five, okay. Was that difficult? Either medically—I mean, did they have,&#13;
um, places where you know, there was a doctor around to help you give birth?&#13;
And then you know, raising the children in the refugee camp?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Yeah, there were hospitals in the refugee camps. If I were pregnant – if I were&#13;
close to giving birth, I could go to hospital and give birth there. But what’s sad is&#13;
that, like, my sister or people who lived in Burma, they, there was no way they&#13;
could afford to go to the hospital in Burma, so it was kind of sad.&#13;
BH: Yeah.&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: I think, personally for me, I had a better life than my sisters had.&#13;
[28:30]&#13;
BH: How different is it now, raising a child here in America compared with in the&#13;
refugee camp?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Well, before –&#13;
[Baby touches microphone]&#13;
– in the refugee camp, yeah, it was different raising a child compared to here and&#13;
in the refugee camp. Back there, I had four kids, my husband would go out and&#13;
work, and if he finds a job then he will bring us some money so we can buy good&#13;
food, good meal. But here, it’s like, he has a job, and it’s better than the refugee&#13;
camp, but here we have a different situation I guess. I’ve been here for seven&#13;
years, and I wanted to go to school, but because of a bad situation I just can’t go&#13;
to school here.&#13;
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BH: Is there anything that would help you be able to go to school here in the United&#13;
States?&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
[baby cries]&#13;
PNI: [speaking in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responds in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Well, before I was pregnant here in United States, I had a teacher, you know. She&#13;
would come and visit me and teach me English. So that was really nice, but she&#13;
moved to Colorado long ago. But now, I don’t expect to go to high school or&#13;
middle school. It’s not something I can handle; I know that very well. But I would&#13;
like a teacher who could come and teach me, because now that my children are&#13;
growing up, I have time to study; learn more English.&#13;
PN: [speaking in Karen]&#13;
[laughs]&#13;
BH: He’s cute. So I wanted to ask, although it sounds like you may have answered my&#13;
question already, but given the chance to go to school, what would you study?&#13;
Although it sounds like English is something that you would really like to learn,&#13;
but is there anything else?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
[33:06]&#13;
PNI: Well no. English is the main thing that I want to learn. However, I do want to&#13;
learn a lot of English so I can communicate on a daily basis. Let’s say if someone&#13;
were to ask me a question, so that I know the answer to that question, or I&#13;
understand that question so I can answer it.&#13;
BH: Mm-hmm. Yeah, so do you think learning English would make living in America&#13;
easier for you?&#13;
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BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Well, yeah, I think if I could understand a lot, but not a hundred percent, then I&#13;
guess it would help a lot, you know. Though it’s not a hundred percent, it would&#13;
help a lot.&#13;
BH: Yeah.&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: And at the same time, my brain is not as good as American people, so it’s not like&#13;
I can really learn English. It’s not like I can learn English like a hundred percent,&#13;
does that make sense?&#13;
[Baby cries]&#13;
BH: I think if I understand what she’s meaning, you can translate it back and make&#13;
sure I’ve got this right, but, it’s difficult once you’re an adult and you’ve already&#13;
learned—&#13;
PNI: Mmm, yeah.&#13;
BH: one language—&#13;
PN: Yeah.&#13;
BH: it’s harder to learn another.&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Yeah.&#13;
BH: Because I think the situation would be – if we were to go to Karen, I think we&#13;
would be in a similar situation.&#13;
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PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Yeah, when I had a teacher, you know the one that moved to Colorado, back then,&#13;
I think I understood English, a lot, I guess. I understood English more than what I&#13;
understand now. Right now, I think I forgot lots of it, yeah.&#13;
PN: [laughs]&#13;
BH: Yeah. So, your first few months after leaving the refugee camp, you came to&#13;
America. What was that like for you and your family?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Yeah, I think it was kind of a little bit challenging. When me and my family first&#13;
came to America, there weren’t a lot of Karen people, and we really didn’t know&#13;
a lot about America I guess. Well, at first, people were giving us those apple juice&#13;
– we thought it was oil, so we didn’t want to touch it. And then when they gave us&#13;
lotion, we didn’t know what it is, so we use it for our face because it smells nice,&#13;
right? If we wanted to say something, there weren’t any interpreters back then.&#13;
And if we wanted to go buy groceries, we didn’t even know where to go.&#13;
BH: Wow. So, what did you end up doing when you needed to buy groceries? Did you&#13;
end up – was there someone around who was also from Karen who helped?&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
[37:36]&#13;
PNI: Yeah, it wasn’t Karen people that helped my family. There weren’t many Karen&#13;
people like I said. It was people from the church. They pretty much helped us&#13;
with everything, I guess. Taking us to the hospital, you know, taking us to go&#13;
shopping, buying us stuff – yeah, from the church.&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Oh, yeah, what I remember is that my oldest daughter – she had like a tooth pain&#13;
back here, the upper one, back here. We went to hospital, you know, and the&#13;
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doctor looked at it, but the doctor took one tooth out, but it was the one at the&#13;
bottom.&#13;
BH: Oh no.&#13;
PNI: But that one had cavities so it was okay, but the one that hurts was the one on top.&#13;
BH: So, it was on the top left?&#13;
PNI: Yeah, top.&#13;
BH: And he took out the bottom left.&#13;
PNI: The bottom left.&#13;
BH: Okay.&#13;
PN: [laughs]&#13;
[speaking in Karen]&#13;
PNI: I had to take my daughter to the hospital again to take the other one out, the upper&#13;
left one.&#13;
BH: How did you communicate that with the dentist, or the man who was working on&#13;
her mouth?&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: We were just using, I guess, sign language – kind of this, that. But we had people&#13;
from the church, like one person who took us to the dentist, but back then there&#13;
was no interpreters, so we can’t tell him what was going on. We just tried to show&#13;
him this and that.&#13;
BH: Yeah, with your hands?&#13;
PNI: Yeah, all without sound.&#13;
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PNI: I didn’t know it either, that she had a tooth that was hurt, but my daughter just&#13;
told me that it hurts. But thought the doctor already took, it was the one on the&#13;
bottom already, but it still hurts.&#13;
BH: So, this church that you mention that helped you? Is this the church that you, or&#13;
the religion that you take part of?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
[40:37]&#13;
PNI: It’s not my religion, that church, but they have a lot of people, you know. It&#13;
doesn’t matter whether you’re that – whether you come from that religion or not.&#13;
And they help a lot of Burmese and Karen refugees.&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Yeah, everybody who’s a refugee doesn’t know anything. So they help with&#13;
everybody I guess.&#13;
[Phone starts ringing]&#13;
BH: Is that you’re phone—no?&#13;
PN: [speaking in Karen]&#13;
PNI: It’s a broken phone.&#13;
BH: Oh.&#13;
[laughs]&#13;
PN: [speaking in Karen]&#13;
BH: Oh, okay.&#13;
PNI: It plays it every morning.&#13;
Cache&#13;
Valley&#13;
Refugee&#13;
Oral&#13;
History&#13;
Project:&#13;
Pyo&#13;
Nwe&#13;
Page&#13;
20&#13;
BH: Okay.&#13;
[laughs]&#13;
BH: So, do you remember what the name of that church was?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: No, but it’s in Salt Lake. It’s the LDS church.&#13;
BH: Okay.&#13;
[Baby makes noises]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: It’s around 300 East.&#13;
BH: Okay, in Salt Lake City?&#13;
PNI: Yeah, in Salt Lake City.&#13;
BH: Okay.&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: I think until today, they’re still helping people who are other refugees.&#13;
BH: Okay. Let me see.&#13;
[baby makes noises]&#13;
BH: So, you mentioned that here in Logan, your husband has a job? What work does&#13;
he do?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
Cache&#13;
Valley&#13;
Refugee&#13;
Oral&#13;
History&#13;
Project:&#13;
Pyo&#13;
Nwe&#13;
Page&#13;
21&#13;
PNI: He works at JBS. He cuts meat. That’s what he does – JBS, yeah.&#13;
BH: Okay. And I think—so you mentioned in the refugee camps, your husband would&#13;
have to leave the camp to work? Was there like a specific job that he had? Or was&#13;
he leaving the camp to find a job?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Yeah, he had to look for work, you know, in the refugee camp – outside of&#13;
refugee camp, I mean.&#13;
BH: Wow.&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
[Baby shakes toy]&#13;
[43:38]&#13;
PNI: Yeah, it just really depends on the day. So, one day you find a job, then you get&#13;
paid. One day, if you can’t find a job, then you don’t get paid.&#13;
BH: So what kinds of jobs could be found in that way? What sorts of work could he&#13;
find?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Well, if it’s around May, then he would work as a, like in a cornfield, where he&#13;
has some kind of corn.&#13;
BH: Kind of seasonal—&#13;
PN: Yes&#13;
PNI: Yes, depends on –&#13;
Cache&#13;
Valley&#13;
Refugee&#13;
Oral&#13;
History&#13;
Project:&#13;
Pyo&#13;
Nwe&#13;
Page&#13;
22&#13;
BH: Whatever was available? Those kinds of things.&#13;
PNI: Yeah.&#13;
BH: Okay. Let’s see. Is there anything that you wish that the people of Logan knew&#13;
about you or your family? Or kind of your culture in general?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Well, I guess I don’t know, you know because, my family we’re from refugees,&#13;
you know, and we didn’t know about America a lot. And today we still don’t&#13;
know a lot about Americans I guess. We just kind of need help, you know. That’s&#13;
basically what she just said.&#13;
BH: Okay, so it’d be good if we could all find a way maybe to learn more about each&#13;
other, yeah?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Yeah, sometimes, I don’t know, if we’re in trouble or something – we just don’t&#13;
know what to do. We just kind of need a guide, I guess.&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
[47:17]&#13;
PNI: Yeah, we’re just kind of a little scared and don’t understand a lot here, so it would&#13;
be nice just to get help.&#13;
BH: Okay, I think I have – I have one more question. Do you think you will ever go&#13;
back to Burma, to Karen State?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
Cache&#13;
Valley&#13;
Refugee&#13;
Oral&#13;
History&#13;
Project:&#13;
Pyo&#13;
Nwe&#13;
Page&#13;
23&#13;
PNI: Yeah, I guess I would want to go back and visit Burma, but I’m not a hundred&#13;
percent sure if I want to go back and live there permanently, you know. Yeah, I&#13;
just don’t have any plans yet for that.&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: At the same time, I’m not a hundred percent sure if I want to live in the United&#13;
States forever either. So yeah, I’m just not planning yet.&#13;
BH: Mm-hmm.&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: And the other reason for me to be staying here is for my children. They have a&#13;
better education here.&#13;
BH: I guess just one question going off of that – do you think you would ever want&#13;
your son here, who was born in America, do you think you would want him to see&#13;
the land where you came from and know that people and that language?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Yeah, like I said, I grew up as a refugee, and I wanted to go back to school but I&#13;
couldn’t. But now I’m here in United States. I want to give my children the&#13;
opportunity to go to school here, graduate, you know – have a better education&#13;
here. After then, I would like them to go back to Burma and help out other people&#13;
you know, to tell them what they learned; to give back to the people in Burma.&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: For me, I want to help my people you know, but I can’t. I know I can’t. But for&#13;
my children, yeah, sure they can one day.&#13;
BH: Well thank you. I think that’s all of my questions, but I want to see if either Wes&#13;
or Meagan – if they have any questions they’d like to ask, if that’s okay?&#13;
PN: Okay, I have a lot of time.&#13;
Cache&#13;
Valley&#13;
Refugee&#13;
Oral&#13;
History&#13;
Project:&#13;
Pyo&#13;
Nwe&#13;
Page&#13;
24&#13;
BH: See, your English is good!&#13;
[51:19]&#13;
WV: I guess I was kind of curious, if you’re not LDS – and I notice you have a picture&#13;
of the Logan temple up on the wall – what is your religious background if you’re&#13;
not LDS?&#13;
WVI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
PN: [responding in Karen]&#13;
PNI: [speaking in Karen]&#13;
PN: [speaking in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Well, back to the refugee camp, I was Buddhist. My whole family was Buddhist.&#13;
But here, me, my husband and –&#13;
[speaks in Karen]&#13;
– and my oldest daughter, us three – we converted to LDS.&#13;
WV: Okay&#13;
BH: Okay&#13;
PNI: We already have, yeah.&#13;
PN: [speaking in Karen]&#13;
PNI: So I guess there are like four more left in my family, still isn’t LDS.&#13;
PN: [speaks in Karen]&#13;
PNI: Well, what I want to say is that it all depends on my daughters I guess. It doesn’t&#13;
matter what religions they choose. It’s all up to them. We don’t have any&#13;
objection to anything.&#13;
Cache&#13;
Valley&#13;
Refugee&#13;
Oral&#13;
History&#13;
Project:&#13;
Pyo&#13;
Nwe&#13;
Page&#13;
25&#13;
PN: [speaks in Karen]&#13;
PNI: For me, I chose it myself, to become LDS. It was my decision.&#13;
BH: Okay, any other questions? No? Well thank you. So I think that’s the end of our&#13;
interview. It is, it’s 11:58 AM, I don’t know if I mentioned, the starting time was&#13;
about 11:04 or 11:05. So thank you, Pyo Nwe, and your little son. So, thanks to&#13;
both of you.&#13;
PN: [laughs, responds in Karen]&#13;
[53:28]</text>
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                <text>Cache Valley Refugee Oral History Project: Aye Win&#13;
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CACHE VALLEY REFUGEE ORAL HISTORY PROJECT&#13;
TRANSCRIPTION COVER SHEET&#13;
Interviewee: Aye Win&#13;
Present: Aye Win, Meagan Gill, Chit Moe, Wes Van de Water, Bethany&#13;
Hanks&#13;
Place of Interview: Aye Win’s home in Logan, Utah&#13;
Date of Interview: May 19, 2015&#13;
Language(s): Karen; English&#13;
Translation:&#13;
Interviewer: Meagan Gill&#13;
Interpreter: Chit Moe&#13;
Recordist: Bethany Hanks&#13;
Photographer: Wes Van de Water&#13;
Recording Equipment: Tascam DR-100mk11 linear PCM recorder; Senal ENG-&#13;
18RL broadcast-quality omnidirectional dynamic&#13;
microphone&#13;
Transcription Equipment:&#13;
Transcribed by: Meagan Gill, May 25, 2015&#13;
Transcript Proofed by: Meagan, May 26, 2015&#13;
Brief Description of Contents: Aye Win describes her life in a refugee camp and in&#13;
Burma before she came to the United States. She explains what brought her to the&#13;
Thailand refugee camp and the difference between her homeland and her home here in&#13;
the United States. Aye Win also talks about her family, English classes, holidays in the&#13;
camp and out of the camp, and keeping in contact with her friends from the refugee&#13;
camp.&#13;
Reference: MG = Meagan Gill&#13;
MGI = Meagan Gill interpreted by translator&#13;
AW = Aye Win&#13;
AWI = Aye Win interpreted by translator&#13;
WV = Wes Van de Water&#13;
WVI = Wes Van de Water interpreted by translator&#13;
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BH = Bethany Hanks&#13;
BHI = Bethany Hanks interpreted by translator&#13;
NOTE: Interjections during pauses or transitions in dialogue such as “uh” and false&#13;
starts and stops in conversations are not included in transcribed. All additions to&#13;
transcript are noted with brackets.&#13;
TAPE TRANSCRIPTION&#13;
[00:01]&#13;
MG: Today is May 19, 2015. Its 1:07. My name is Meagan I am here with Bethany&#13;
Hanks, doing uh…audio (laughing), and Wes Van de Water, he’s taking pictures&#13;
today. We are students from Utah State University working on an oral history&#13;
project, refugees for Cache Valley. And today I am interviewing Aye Win.&#13;
Thanks for letting us interview you today. Can I have you state your full name&#13;
and birth year for me please?&#13;
AW: My name is Aye Win. Uh, my birthday May 1, 1974.&#13;
MG: K. Thanks. And what languages do you speak?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: I speak Karen &amp; Burmese.&#13;
MG: K. Tell me about your family?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: Can you rephrase that. A she’s not getting that question.&#13;
MG: Um…Tell me about your parents &amp; spouse &amp; children &amp; where they are at?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
[laughing]&#13;
AWI: Okay. Well, she’s still not understanding your question I guess. Well, she told me&#13;
that um... our family, my family came here for education purposes.&#13;
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[laughing]&#13;
[2:30]&#13;
MG: Okay.&#13;
AWI So you might want to ask in a different way I guess.&#13;
MG: Okay, sure. Start with how many children do you have?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: Four, four.&#13;
MG: Okay. And do you have any other family with you here?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: No&#13;
MG: Okay. Can you describe the ethnic or religious community that you belong to if&#13;
any?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: My religious is Buddhist and that’s it.&#13;
MG: Okay. Can you tell me about your birth country?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: From Burma. I was born in Burma.&#13;
MG: How long did you live there?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
[3:44]&#13;
AWI: About fifteen years.&#13;
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MG: K. And why did you leave?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: When or why?&#13;
MG: Why?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
[4:19]&#13;
AWI: Well, uh when I was little you know um, I just kinda follow my parents I guess.&#13;
And there were Burmese military everywhere you know. They come to our&#13;
village they were attacking us and me I just follow my parents. We had to sleep in&#13;
a forest for three or five days. And then when we come back I’m just going back&#13;
with them so that’s why I think I…that’s why I left Burma.&#13;
MG: Okay. And after the forest where did you go?&#13;
AWI: Going back home.&#13;
MG: Back home to?&#13;
AWI: To village. Okay.&#13;
MG: To village.&#13;
[4:55]&#13;
AWI: So the…the Burmese military come attack everybody in the village so to escape&#13;
that we went to the forest. We slept there for a few days then when…you know&#13;
things quiet down we come back to our village again.&#13;
MG: Okay. And what was your experience like in a refugee camp?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
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[5:49]&#13;
AWI: [clears throat] Well, my experience in refugees, um. Well, my experience in&#13;
refugee camp I got married and um...I had one children in refugee camp and back&#13;
then I wanted to go back home to visit Burma. But I was so scared that I’d…I’d&#13;
never get a chance to go back.&#13;
[laughing]&#13;
MG: Okay. Can you tell me about the food and medical care you received in the camp?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
[7:03]&#13;
AWI: Um. Well, yes we…we do receive food and medical care in the refugee camp, but&#13;
for a pregnant women when I was pregnant back then. Um, we had like people&#13;
what organization who are called AMI, IRC, they like come every week and give&#13;
us…give the pregnant woman um…some like five eggs um…one bottle of oil and&#13;
then one bag of beans. So, you know just to keep the pregnant ladies healthy. So,&#13;
yeah if you…you were about to give birth and they’d take you to like…they’d&#13;
keep you at a hospital so like…they’d admit you to the hospital so that you can&#13;
stay and give birth. So, yeah.&#13;
[camera clicking]&#13;
MG: Did you work or go to school in the camp at all?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
[8:17]&#13;
AWI: Yeah, well when I was small I did go to school uh…I went to school for four days&#13;
and that’s it. And after I got married I just never got a chance to go to school&#13;
again because I had to take care of my kids you know. And I ran eh uh…a little&#13;
shop in a refugee camp and I kinda sell stuff. Groceries.&#13;
MG: K. What were the day to day living conditions like in the camp like?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
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AWI: Well, um…for…for guys, you know [clear throat] uh…for day to day they’d go&#13;
outside of camp and go and uh…plant corn, pick chilies, but for a woman&#13;
they’d…they’d stay home and take care of kids. And if they’d have more time&#13;
they’d also go outside of the camp and do the same thing as the guys.&#13;
MG: Okay. And did you celebrate any holy days, holidays in the camp?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: Yes. Like Karen New Year we have Karen New Year and Christmas day and&#13;
those kinds of holidays.&#13;
[10:09]&#13;
MG: Okay. Did you use any special like decorations or were you able to get any kind&#13;
of presents for the holidays?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: Yes, for Christmas we…we do. I did receive gifts like from a friend and then I&#13;
kinda have to give it back. Like you know from friend to friend thing. So, yes.&#13;
MG: K. What was the political climate like in the camp?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
[laughing]&#13;
AWI: Um I…I don’t know.&#13;
[laughing]&#13;
MG: K. Did you feel safe in the camp?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: Yeah, um I mean I do like living in a refugee camp, but it just uh…sometimes like&#13;
we you know just kinda have to live with fears I guess. Cuz you had to be afraid&#13;
of the Burmese soldiers. You know they’ll kind of…will come your burn…will&#13;
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come and burn the…the refugee camp cuz they do that all the time. Or sometimes&#13;
we had be afraid of Burmese military and the Karen military they were fighting&#13;
each other and we were…I was afraid I might get hit. So yeah.&#13;
[camera clicking]&#13;
MG: How did you learn about the U.S refugee program?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
[13:26]&#13;
AWI: Okay, well so. Well, so…so you know I didn’t learn huh…well I so…the thing is&#13;
so…when I was let’s say teenagers age. Around teenagers age um…um…the&#13;
Burmese military were coming and forcing people to you know forcing people to&#13;
become a potter. And they were looking for especially like…like…eighteen to&#13;
seventeen years old man or woman. Both man and woman. So, you know I…me&#13;
and my friend we were just really scared. We were like uh…it’s not safe to live in&#13;
here anymore. Let’s just go to Thailand. Let’s just cross the border. So, yeah we&#13;
decided…we went to Thailand and we stay in a city. In the city uh…it’s more like&#13;
a town. It’s called The-wa-fa. We stay in that city. We stay there for a few months&#13;
picking corn, chilies.&#13;
[translator interrupts]&#13;
AWI: You guys want to write that [laughing]? T. h.e…the wa dablu o wa. How do you&#13;
spell? Wa. [laughing] Thaw.&#13;
AWI continued: Yeah, we stay there for a…just a few months doing daily things.&#13;
Picking chilies, planting corn. And it was nice. But then after…after um…I can’t&#13;
remember the date, but the Burmese military and the Karen military were in they&#13;
were in conflict…conflicts. And they were fighting each other and then that…that&#13;
war went straight for three days and three nights. So, me and my friend were&#13;
really scared you know because of what was going on around us. So…and a lot of&#13;
people died that…in those three days and so...and everybody was running you&#13;
know just running for their lives. So…so…what can I do I just kind of follow&#13;
everybody where they’re going and…and me I ended up in a refugee camp and&#13;
so…I guess that’s how I learned about refugee camp.&#13;
MG: Okay. And how did you apply and who helped you get to the U.S?&#13;
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MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
[cut in audio]&#13;
[16:55]&#13;
AWI: Well, yeah there isn’t anybody to help, but it’s not hard. It’s not a difficult process&#13;
to…to come to the United States. You know, you just have to fill out an&#13;
application and they’ll call your names you know. Hey, so you’re um…set to go&#13;
to United States. That’s what they’ll tell you, but the thing is um…I…I did not&#13;
know that you know I have to pay rent, utility bills, insurance bills. Everything&#13;
you know. But in…in compared to refugees’ camp or Burma you don’t pay&#13;
anything. You have a house you stay, you do what you want. Nothing is…you&#13;
don’t have to pay anything basically, but here its different you know. In order you&#13;
know in order to let you…you had to pay rent and things and stuff. So, yeah.&#13;
MG: K. Tell me about coming to the United States? When did you first arrive here?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: Um… I…I got here on June 9, 2008.&#13;
MG: And where did you first come…come to?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AW: Salt Lake City&#13;
AWI: In Salt Lake.&#13;
MG: Okay. What were the first months like?&#13;
[18:24]&#13;
AWI: Well, we didn’t like it you know. We don’t speak the language. We don’t know&#13;
what to do or where to go. Or we don’t like…like clueless. So, no we didn’t like&#13;
the first month.&#13;
MG: Okay. Did you receive any help from the U.S. or religious organizations when&#13;
you got here?&#13;
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MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
[19:18]&#13;
AWI: Yes. Um…so when I first arrive in the United States I…I did went…went to…to&#13;
the church for a few months I guess. And like during Christmas they will come&#13;
buy my child like a shoes, like boots and stuff. So yes we…I did received help&#13;
from the religious church.&#13;
[19:34]&#13;
MG: Okay. Did you get help from any other organizations?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: Yes. There is another organization called IRC and that’s where we came like, we&#13;
had to go through their office…not office, but we had to go through like,&#13;
applications and stuff. And they were the ones that bring us here you know. And&#13;
they had to take care of us for three months. There yeah, there was like their&#13;
promise or something. So we receive plates and blankets, and kind of a lot of stuff&#13;
from them. Yeah.&#13;
MG: Okay. [clear throat] How long have you lived in Cache Valley?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: About six and a half years.&#13;
MG: K. And what do you do here?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
[20:54]&#13;
AWI: Um…[clear throat] Well, before um…I used to work at elementary school. I&#13;
kinda, but I already quit that job, but now because I have a little child to take care&#13;
of. I can just stay home. Yeah.&#13;
MG: Okay. What’s it like for you and your family here?&#13;
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MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: I guess we um…Well, we are surviving here day to day and that is good. We get&#13;
pay you know my dad. My husband. [laughing] He works at JBS and um…then&#13;
we get pay every two weeks. We use those money to pay rent to pay utility bills.&#13;
It’s all gone. We get it again. It just kinda go in circles. Yeah.&#13;
[22:02]&#13;
MG: Okay. Do you feel included in the Logan community?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
[22:22]&#13;
AWI: Um…not really. Because you know I don’t speak English. So, yeah. [laughing]&#13;
MG: Alright. What would make you feel more included in the community?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: [laughing] Uh, I don’t know.&#13;
[22:51]&#13;
MG: Okay. Tell me about your home her. How’s it different from your home in your&#13;
birth country?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
[23:32]&#13;
AWI: Um, so it’s really different. Um, here um…I mean back in Burma you know&#13;
where my birth country is. You kinda live. The only thing you…you have to fear&#13;
is that the Burmese military. Other than that you don’t actually have any worries.&#13;
You don’t have to worry about rent, bills, or food. You can kinda go out work.&#13;
You get pay. You can either by like I know small stuff…just kinda go day to day&#13;
without a lot of worries. But here you kinda have to kinda think of everything.&#13;
Think of: Oh, I need to have this much to pay for my rent. So…here you just kind&#13;
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of think…think of financial situation here you know. You can’t you…just have to&#13;
keep in mind that it’s different from your home here. So, I guess that’s the&#13;
difference.&#13;
[24:40]&#13;
MG: Okay. Can you tell me your experiences with your landlord?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
[25:06]&#13;
AWI: Well, this well…the current manager well…call him manager because she’s the&#13;
manager of the land. She’s really nice you know. Let’s say something wrong with&#13;
our house we…I can…I can go there and be like: Hey something is wrong. But&#13;
although I don’t speak English she will come and look at it herself and that’s&#13;
really nice, but the previous manager kinda not that nice. So good experience.&#13;
MG: Okay. What would you like people in Logan to know about you, your family, or&#13;
your ethnic group:&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: [laughing] I don’t know. [laughing]&#13;
MG: Mmm…let’s see. Would you like to go back to your country?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: Yes, um… my dad is…my dad is still in Burma. And I want to go back. I just&#13;
don’t have the money to go back yet. So, yeah. One day.&#13;
MG: Would you ever go back to live?&#13;
[26:52]&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
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AWI: Well, it’s something that I have thought of…going back and staying there&#13;
permanently. But I’m not sure yet because my children are still going to school&#13;
and you know I still have to be here and support them. So, but yeah. Not sure.&#13;
MG: What are you most proud of?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
[27:57]&#13;
AWI: Well, uh my children they have a...you know better life here than I did back then.&#13;
So, I’m really happy for that and now Chit Moe, that’s me [laughing], uh…going&#13;
to college is really good thing I guess you know. I’m happy to see my child get to&#13;
go to college and that’s just had never happened in my family.&#13;
MG: Nice. What are your dreams for the future?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
[28:57]&#13;
AWI: For my future dream I would say for every for my four childrens I really want&#13;
them to have education. I really want them to have knowledge you know. Even if&#13;
me and my husband die I’m sure they would still be able to live and support&#13;
themselves with what they learned you know. So, yeah. [laughing]&#13;
MG: Okay. Would you ever like to go to school again?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: Yes. I am planning on taking English classes at ELC soon because I failed citizen&#13;
test two times already. So, I feel the need of taking it…taking the English class&#13;
again.&#13;
MG: Okay.&#13;
AWI: Okay.&#13;
[29:54]&#13;
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MG: Do you have any favorite activities to do here in Logan?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
[30:44]&#13;
AWI: I’m not sure. [laughing] I don’t know. I guess, I mean there are a lot of things to&#13;
do in Logan, but...Yeah, so.&#13;
MG: Okay. Well, is there anything that I haven’t asked you that you’d like to tell us?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: Well, no. Not really, but I’m just thankful for you guys being here and doing&#13;
interview. So. [laughing]&#13;
MG: That’s all of my questions. Do you mind if my colleagues…if they have any&#13;
questions they can ask you?&#13;
MGI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
[signaled in the positive]&#13;
BH: Um…I have some questions. So, I was wondering about these um…the lights up&#13;
here. Are they just decoration…you just like having them up?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: Yeah, just for decorations and we keep that for Christmas. [laughing]&#13;
BH: I bet they look nice. Um…&#13;
AWI: No go ahead.&#13;
BH: That actually reminds me of a question I had. So you…you mentioned that you’re&#13;
Buddhist and in the camps though, you celebrate Christmas. Is that a holiday that&#13;
um…Buddhist’s normally celebrate? I just wonder.&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
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[32:54]&#13;
AWI: Yes, uh…like I say I was a Buddhist back in refugee camp, but I have friends who&#13;
are not Buddhist you know. They celebrate Christmas and I don’t want to be&#13;
stranger or anything. So, just kind of you know were friends. So, yeah Christmas.&#13;
So, that’s how that happened.&#13;
BH: Okay. And you still celebrate Christmas?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: Yes, and it’s still for the same reasons. Have friends heres and sometimes they&#13;
come and celebrate. Um… likes with Karen um…I don’t know. Well, she hasn’t&#13;
talked this, but it’s from my…no…never mind…no.&#13;
[signaled to go ahead]&#13;
Um…so Karen I think every Christmas like, especially with their Christianity&#13;
they…they will go house to house and play music with their guitar. Like a group&#13;
of Karen…like big group and they will come to your door and sing. So, it’s just&#13;
kind of…does…did you guys do that? Or?&#13;
[MG, BH, and WV answer at once]&#13;
MG: Caroling.&#13;
MG, BH, and WV: Yeah.&#13;
BH: Christmas caroling.&#13;
WV: Caroling.&#13;
AWI: Oh really, okay. So that’s not strange yeah.&#13;
BH: Mmm…hmm. Usually, just without a guitar.&#13;
AWI: But it’s with a guitar. Yeah.&#13;
BHI: It’s with a guitar.&#13;
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AWI: Yeah.&#13;
BH: So, why a guitar?&#13;
AWI: Well, so you can sing better. You can follow the tone or something. [laughing] I&#13;
don’t know. I’ve just never been to one. Um, like back…back in refugee camp&#13;
you know we had uh…we had people like Christianity there they come to our&#13;
house they and help us. So, it’s only polite for me to you know help them back.&#13;
So, yup.&#13;
MG: K.&#13;
BH: Um…sorry I’m just really curious about this guitar. Um… do people have guitars&#13;
in the refugee camps?&#13;
AWI: I can answer that. Yes.&#13;
BH: Was there a lot of music there?&#13;
AWI: Yes.&#13;
BH: Like what kinds of music? Was it like um…popular songs? I don’t know like&#13;
maybe American songs? Or was it like its traditional?&#13;
AWI: It’s mostly either Burmese songs or Karen songs. Like the...you know, like the top&#13;
ten songs. [conversation in Karen] I’m doing it. Well, yeah they…we have lot of&#13;
songs and going back to the Christmas thing you like know, like in a refugee&#13;
camp when there’s like people going to house to house to sings there’s just gonna&#13;
be lots of people kinda follow up. You know kinda join the group to do the same&#13;
thing. So.&#13;
[laughing]&#13;
BH: It sounds like a good time.&#13;
AWI: Right.&#13;
[36:10]&#13;
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WV: Um…I’m just kind of curious who is the man in that photo up on the wall in that&#13;
chair?&#13;
AWI: On the left?&#13;
WV: Uh…uh, the bigger one. The guy in the…what looks like brown robes.&#13;
WVI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: Its what his name is Thaminya. He is a…a… a highly…everybody knows person&#13;
in Buddhist religions.&#13;
WV: Okay.&#13;
AWI: And he’s… he’s the monk in Burma and he’s rally um…you know. But there’s&#13;
just I guess, so many things that happen to him that are miracle or something.&#13;
Like, I don’t know if this trues…truth or not it maybe a myth, but like when he&#13;
die. Well, he’s dead already and, but his…his fingernails are still growing. So, it’s&#13;
just weird. I guess you know he just kind of have supernatural power or&#13;
something and may people Buddhist…. Yeah. And it is true right. This particular&#13;
person you know he…he’s still in Burma although he died many, many years ago.&#13;
His corpse is still there and it’s not being… how do I say it?&#13;
BH: It’s not decomposed?&#13;
AWI: It’s not decomposing. Yeah. It’s not.&#13;
WV: Did they preserve it? Like, did they do anything to…?&#13;
AWI: Like they probably. Nobody knows whether they preserve it or not. It’s under&#13;
military control and nobody knows. Like government control. I think they&#13;
probably did. Come on. [laughing] K. Yeah.&#13;
[38:04]&#13;
BH: I have one more question. This is something I’ve been curious about cuz it sounds&#13;
like in the refugee camps um…you can meet with a lot of people. There are a lot&#13;
of people around. So, um…did you have a lot of friends in the refugee camp?&#13;
People that you would meet with a lot?&#13;
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17&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: Yes. I had lots of friends in refugee camp. Yeah.&#13;
BH: Are there any that came here to the United States as well?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: Yes, but they’re not in Utah. They’re in different states within the Unites States.&#13;
So.&#13;
BH: Are you able to keep in contact with any of them?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: Yes, um…we kinda...we kinda call each other you know. Friends to friends just&#13;
like everybody would do. But, mostly what we all concern about: How…how is&#13;
life doing over there? But, everybody wants to go back home. So, basically.&#13;
BH: Back home to Burma?&#13;
BHI: [repeating question in Karen]&#13;
AWI: Yes, to Burma. But, in Karen State particularly. To that state, yeah.&#13;
BH: Cool. Thank you.&#13;
AWI: Good?&#13;
MG: Thank you.&#13;
AW: Thank you.&#13;
[End recording-39:52]</text>
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                <text>An inventory for this collection can be found at : http://nwda.orbiscascade.org/ark:/80444/xv67608</text>
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                <text>Cache Valley Refugee Oral History Project Digital Collection</text>
              </elementText>
            </elementTextContainer>
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          <element elementId="47">
            <name>Rights</name>
            <description>Information about rights held in and over the resource</description>
            <elementTextContainer>
              <elementText elementTextId="93385">
                <text>Reproduction for publication, exhibition, web display or commercial use is only permissible with the consent of the USU Special Collections and Archives, phone (435) 797-2663;</text>
              </elementText>
            </elementTextContainer>
          </element>
          <element elementId="48">
            <name>Source</name>
            <description>A related resource from which the described resource is derived</description>
            <elementTextContainer>
              <elementText elementTextId="93386">
                <text>Utah State University, Merrill-Cazier Library, Special Collections and Archives, Cache Valley Refugee Oral History Project, FOLK COLL 58</text>
              </elementText>
            </elementTextContainer>
          </element>
          <element elementId="49">
            <name>Subject</name>
            <description>The topic of the resource</description>
            <elementTextContainer>
              <elementText elementTextId="93387">
                <text>Pyo Nwe--Photographs;</text>
              </elementText>
            </elementTextContainer>
          </element>
          <element elementId="50">
            <name>Title</name>
            <description>A name given to the resource</description>
            <elementTextContainer>
              <elementText elementTextId="93388">
                <text>Pyo Nwe close up</text>
              </elementText>
            </elementTextContainer>
          </element>
          <element elementId="51">
            <name>Type</name>
            <description>The nature or genre of the resource</description>
            <elementTextContainer>
              <elementText elementTextId="93389">
                <text>Image; Still Image;</text>
              </elementText>
            </elementTextContainer>
          </element>
        </elementContainer>
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    <tagContainer>
      <tag tagId="60">
        <name>Cache Valley Refugee Oral History Project</name>
      </tag>
    </tagContainer>
  </item>
</itemContainer>
