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Kahsay Gebremedhin interview transcript, May 23, 2015
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Kahsay Gebremedhin interview transcript, May 23, 2015
Description
Interview conducted with Kahsay Gebremedhin by Magen Olsen on May 23, 2015. Translated by Berhane Debesai. Discussion on Eritrea farming practices, Ethiopian refugee camps, etc.
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CACHE VALLEY REFUGEE ORAL HISTORY PROJECT
TRANSCRIPTION COVER SHEET
Interviewee(s): Kahsaoy Berhe Gebremedhin
Present: Magen Olsen, Kahsaoy Berhe Gebremedhin, Berhane, Hilary Warner-
Evans, Heidi Williams
Place of Interview:
Date of Interview: May 23, 2015
Language(s): Tigrinya
Translation:
Interviewer: Magen Olsen
Interpreter: Berhane
Recordist: Heidi Williams
Photographer: Hilary Warner-Evans
Recording Equipment: Tascam DR-100mk11 linear PCM recorder; Senal ENG-18RL
broadcast-quality omnidirectional dynamic microphone
Transcription Equipment: Express Scribe with PowerPlayer foot pedal.
Transcribed by: Susan Gross, May 26, 2015
Transcript Proofed by:
Brief Description of Contents: Mr. Kahsaoy Berhe Gebremedhin talks about his life in Eritrea,
his family, and escaping to Ethiopia as a refugee. He talks about his time spent at Shimelba
refugee camp in Ethiopia, and the process he followed to come to the United States as a refugee.
He discusses life in America, his current job and his dream to have a farm.
Reference: MO = Magen Olsen
MOI = Magen Olsen’s words interpreted by translator
KG = Kahsaoy Berhe Gebremedhin
KGI = Kahsaoy Berhe Gebremedhin’s words interpreted by translator
NOTE: [You will have to modify this as appropriate—whether using CommGap or in-person
interpreter.] The interview was conducted with CommGap Interpretive Services; the interpreter
joined the interview via a cell phone. False starts, pauses, or transitions in dialogue such as “uh”
and starts and stops in conversations are not included in transcript. All additions and added
information to transcript are noted with brackets.
TAPE TRANSCRIPTION
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[Part 1 of 2 – 00:01]
MO: Alright; we are here, it is – of course we are here – it is Saturday [laughing], ten o’clock
in the morning, May 23rd, 2015. It’s raining today for about the 100th day –
??: In a row.
MO: [Laughing] It seems like it’s been rainy every, single day. We are here with Kahsaoy,
right?
KG: Yes.
MO: Who is a refugee from Eritrea; translating for him is Berhane. We have Hilary Warner-
Evans on the photography end of things, and Heidi Williams is recording and taking
some notes. And we’re going to go ahead and start.
So how are you doing today?
KG: Good.
MO: Good, good. Thanks for meeting with us, and for being willing to talk with us and share
some things about your experiences as a refugee, living in the United States.
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: Thank you.
MO: So we’ll start with the first question is what is your full name and birth year?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: His name is Kahsaoy Berhe Gebremedhin; he was born in 1971.
MO: Okay. What languages do you speak?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: Tigrinya.
MO: That’s it?
KGI: He speaks Tigrinya.
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KG: Yes.
MO: Perfect. And tell me about your family?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Okay. [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: I have three children here, in America, and I got five more back in Eritrea. I have one
brother here, in America, and I have six siblings back home.
MO: So do they – your family members – they all live here (who are in America)?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, yeah.
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, three of them they are here (the youngest ones) –
KG: [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KGI: But he got five more in Africa, two of them are in the Ethiopia refugee camp – the rest
three are in Eritrea.
[03:28]
MO: So that’s got to be hard, being all over?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, it’s still hard because people are everywhere; even it’s hard for me – some of them,
they are in the refugee camp, there is nothing over there – I have to send them money to
support family there. It’s kind of hard.
MO: What religion are you?
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MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: He is Eritrean Orthodox Church.
MO: Okay, good. Can you tell me a bit about Eritrea, where you’re from?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Eritrea is a good place to live, but there is some problem – [speaking in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah; he says it’s harder to [??] stuff it has to do with farming, and we don’t have a lot
and we don’t know anything about the life in the cities. So generally, the economy [??]
MO: Did you grow up on a farm then?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, they are all from –
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Farmer.
MO: What did you grow – animals, grain?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[06:20]
KGI: We raise grains – we don’t have any technology, we plow the field by oxes; and when it
comes to harvesting season, we harvest it manually and with the help of animals. And we
also have animal harvest[??].
MO: Okay. So did you live in the – Berhane has talked about highlands and lowlands – did
you live in the highlands or the lowlands?
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MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: He was living in the lowlands.
MO: Cool. How long did you live there? So how long have you been in the U.S., I guess?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: He has been in American almost a year and eight months.
MO: Good.
KG: 2013.
KGI: He came here on 2013.
MO: Cool. Why did you leave Eritrea?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: I was in the National Service [??] army, and I have a lot of children – nobody supporting
them behind me, and he is not getting anything. Finally he get frustrated and left Eritrea
with the refugee camp in Ethiopia.
MO: And when did you do that?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: Refugee – 2007.
KGI: 2007.
KG: Yeah.
MO: So six years in Ethiopia?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
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KGI: Yeah, six years and some couple of months.
KG: [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, he went there on July 15, 2007 – [speaking in Tigrinya to the interviewee]
[09:20]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.] 2013 –
KGI: [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
And he came here on September 2013.
KG: [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KGI: On the 18th of September, 2013. So, do your calc –
[Laughter]
MO: I will once –
KGI: It’s easier to do once –
MO: Yeah, if you’re already there –
[Laughing]
So you’re in science, and we’re all in [laughs] folklore.
KG: [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, six years two months and three days.
MO: Perfect.
KGI: [??]
[Laughter]
MO: Two months, three days.
So what was the experience like in leaving?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
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KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, I don’t have any problem because I was born there, I know the whole land and we
got farms in between. There was army soldiers in the trench, but sometimes they just
don’t care because we go back and forth for our animals and farms; and he went to his
brother and didn’t get any problem – he just crossed.
MO: It’s hard for other people then, right (usually)?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: For me it was easy because I was raised in the rural areas, and we got animals so we cross
all over the place (because our animals for food and water to the animals). But for some
people who came from the capital or from the highlands – they didn’t know the area,
even we are raised differently (maybe they cannot hike a lot). Sometimes they don’t
know the land, they just go directly to the army, they get captured, and god knows what
they do with them. But for me it was easy; but for some people it’s a lot harder.
MO: That makes sense. So you relocated first to Ethiopia, right?
[12:37]
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, from Eritrea he relocated to the Shimelba refugee camps in Ethiopia – the camp
name is Shimelba. Do you want to spell?
MO: Yeah.
[Laughter]
KGI: S-H-I-M-L-B-A. Shimelba. So he relocated from Eritrea to the refugee camp in Ethiopia.
MO: And then did you go to any other refugee camps?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: From that refugee camp he directly came to the United States.
MO: Okay. What was your experience like in that camp?
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MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: It was kind of okay for me because I was raised in rural area, and that place was a rural
area. And since I was raised working with my family, in that refugee camp I was allowed
to work; I was working, earning money. So for me it was not [??]; it was kind of okay.
MO: But it would be hard for people from the capital, maybe?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[15:43]
KGI: For some people it was hard because we were getting only 15 kilos of weight (around 30
pounds), and I was raised in a rural area around that area, so it was okay for me – I can go
and work, communicate with the people because they got the same behavior[??]. But the
refugee in the [??], they tend not to leave the camp – if you leave the camp it’s all your
responsibility if something happens, so some people they get scared; but for me, it’s okay
just leave and work – clear my mind and then come back. So some people they don’t
want to leave the camp, some people they don’t know how to work in the farm. So you
can’t [??] with the 15 kilos of weight; if you are lucky, if you have families in the U.S. or
England, they ask for money or for help. But there were a lot of people struggling in that
camp.
MO: Did they have small houses for you, or how was the living situation?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah most of the times they don’t give us houses; for his case he get a plot of land – most
of the time they give them a plot of land, you have to make your own house. Even for
him they didn’t give him a plot of land, there was some of his friends (they have their
own plot of land, they give it to him – he build his own house. He don’t know if they
made houses for the first arrival refugees (because the refugee camp starts a couple of
years before he arrived). He hears they help some women if they got problems, maybe
children or other stuff; but if you are a man, they don’t give you anything – they just give
you a plot of land: you have to make your own house.
MO: So did you arrive by yourself and then some of your family came after?
[18:38]
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MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: I cross the border with my brother – he has three children here – he met a woman over
there, he get married with her in the refugee camp, and then she came here.
MO: Okay.
KGI: Only he made his house –
KG: [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KGI: And now they are not even married, they are friends.
MO: Okay. Is she still there, or is she here?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: She is here.
MO: Okay, good. Were you assigned a job, or did you kind of find one on your own?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: In my case I was going out to the farmers near the camp, and ask the job from them –
they can give you farm work, or construction – not big construction, but he just make
some building walls and things like that – I do whatever I find. But there are some people
they are educated [??] they work with [??] the camp, or something with the refugee
administration. But for him, he was going to farmers and ask for a job.
MO: Okay. How did you celebrate holidays in your camp?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[21:39]
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KGI: Because it’s the same culture, so we have everything what we can have in Eritrea; with
whatever we got we make injera, we make soya (soya is a local drink in Eritrea), and we
kill a goat, and we celebrate.
MO: Is it easier – it’s probably easier, I shouldn’t even be asking this – it’s probably easier to
celebrate in the camp, then (your holidays), rather than in the U.S., right?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah he said in American you can find anything at the shopping centers, but some people
– they have money, they can afford it; but there are lot of them who cannot afford it. So it
is easier here in American than in the camp.
MO: Okay. Because you can’t go to Wal-Mart and buy a goat or a sheep [laughs].
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah you can buy meat over there.
[Laughter]
MO: That’s true. Well but we have farms, too, that you can go to and buy animals, right?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: Yeah [responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah there is an old man and a woman somewhere in this 600 South, they sell sheeps,
chickens – I always go there and buy goats. [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: And they got a place, and he kills a goat and takes the meat and sells it fresh over there.
MO: Good. They’re not worried about that or anything?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: They got a place for killing the sheep –
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MO: Um-hmm?
KGI: Even they show up, “Hey, you want to kill it – go kill it over there,” (to kill fresh stuff).
MO: Nice! That’s a good deal.
KG: Um-hmm [speaking in Tigrinya].
KGI: And they know us – when they see us they say, “Ah, it’s the guys who kill the goats.”
[Laughter]
KG: [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KGI: I know they don’t like us to kill the sheeps because they show us the place and they run
away to their apartment.
[Laughter]
[25:02]
MO: Yeah, I think it’s alarming for Americans to think that they would have to kill their own
animals; we just like to pretend that we’re not eating animals, I think.
KGI: Yeah. [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
[Laughter]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: I understand that.
[Laughter]
MO: I feel like the weird one, because it makes sense to take care of your own food like that.
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: So he said for us it’s very [??]: we want to take care of our own food, we feel comfortable
when we kill our sheep or goat. Sometimes it’s kind of hard to go to the shop and buy a
meat because you don’t know who killed the sheep. We are kind of strict in our religion
orthodox: you have to kill it yourself, you have to say, “By the name of God, Son, and the
Holy Spirit;” and we feel comfortable. Most of the time we eat only sheep or goat, so if
it’s other animal, hmm, we don’t feel comfortable (because we don’t eat pork).
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MO: That’s typically a Muslim –
KGI: If it’s Muslim they don’t eat it before we kill it.
MO: Oh, okay. But I mean that’s Old Law, right?
KGI: Yeah, it come from the Jews.
MO: Right.
KGI: Then the Muslim and the Christian, they are branches.
MO: Because I know with like Catholics and Protestants – they don’t have any problem eating
pork.
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[28:22]
KGI: Yeah, Islam – they have their own way; they are different from us. But if I go to Wal-
Mart and buy meat, I don’t know whether it’s a sheep’s meat, or it’s a donkey’s meat: it’s
just a meat, we don’t know. But according the way we are raised, and according to our
religion – if I kill it, I know it’s a sheep or a goat. So we feel comfortable if we kill our
sheep and goat (or other animals), and we know what we are killing, and we blessed it by
saying, “In the name of God, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.” So we feel comfortable if we
kill our own animals, rather than going to Wal-Mart and buying meat we don’t know.
MO: Do you feel safe in the camp?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: For me, I was not scared for my safety; I always go out of the camp, work in the field,
even sometime there are nights I spend my nights in the field. I am not a city boy – I was
raised in farm and all our thing is doing the fields and spending the nights with the
animals. So I didn’t have any problem, and I wasn’t scared because I don’t have any
crime, I don’t have [??]. But there might be some people, even I remember one person
who died in the fields – nobody knows who killed him; still nobody knows what
happened to that guy.
MO: Hmm. Did you feel welcomed by the Ethiopians? Because I know that you’re very
closely related.
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MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
[31:20]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: As long as I was over there I don’t have any problem. Even I don’t have any problem,
they always tell us not to leave the camp; if you leave the camp you are responsible for
what happen to you – and they are right, they cannot protect you out of the camp. But
with the people who are just going together, going along – we don’t have any problem.
But I heard when I come here there was some fight in the camp.
MO: Hmm. How did you learn about the U.S. refugee program?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: When I was crossing the border from Eritrea to Ethiopia, I didn’t have any idea about the
U.S. refugee program, I just knew I wanted when I went to the refugee camp.
KG: [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, when we crossed (me and my brother), we don’t know what was the refugee
program over there (even we didn’t know there was a camp). So when they crossed the
border, the people who give them – after they crossed Ethiopia they were talking to [??]
Amharic[?], but he don’t know Amharic[?], his brother knows a little bit of Hamari –
they were telling them, “You guys are going to Shimelba refugee camp, there are other
Eritreans over there. You guys will go to America.” And [??] says what is Amharic
talking about; but when they took them the refugee camp there were lots of Eritreans, and
they knew the refugee program to the United States from the other Eritreans who were in
the camp before them.
MO: Did they help you apply – because it sounds like they told you, you were going to go?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[36:22]
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KGI: Okay. When he crossed first the border the Ethiopian army, when they caught you they
took you to some place (they call it [??]), then they register, “Who are you guys? Where
do you come from?” Things like that. Then after they confirm they are from Eritrea and
things like that, they send them to Shimelba refugee camp. Then the Shimelba [??] the
refugee camp, they transfer all your paperwork with them, because these people in [??],
they ask them a lot of questions in their own office, they register them. So they send their
resume and their session papers refugee camp in Shimelba. In the Shimelba camp there
are a lot of organizations they put them. There is Ara[??], these Ara are the people who
gives them food – that means who gives them the food and other things. And there is a
UNCR – they process the papers for a refugee to United States.
[Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, this UNCR – they process their guys to U.S., Australia and Canada. But there is
not a lot of obligations things to do if you are in the country on the border, they put in
paperwork, the Ethiopian army or police [??] – they transfer all their papers Shimelba
refugee camp; after that you just wait for interview.
MO: So the process took six years? When did you interview?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[38:37]
KGI: Yeah, he is not sure about the months, but the interview was around 2010.
KG: [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KGI: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
He said I don’t remember the exact month, but I have my own record so maybe it’s in my
cards.
MO: It will be important for your kids and grandkids one day.
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: Yeah.
MO: Tell me about coming to the U.S. – what was it like?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
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KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[Conversation back and forth between Kahsaoy and Berhane in Tigrinya.]
[42:12]
KGI: Yeah, he said when they come here they got a problem transit in Germany –
[Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Transit in Frankfurt – so when they leave the airplane the IOM people (they are the
people who help with them with the airplane tickets, because they have to pay it back) –
one of the IOM came he took other people, but for us he told us, “Just number 57.” And
he said I don’t know anything about airports, even I don’t know anything about city life
so I don’t know where to find number 57. But finally I just found it, but when I go over
there I don’t know who to ask and I don’t know what to do. And we were struggling and
stressed out in that airport; finally I saw an Ethiopian guy (he speaks some Amharic), and
I talk to him. Then he went inside and he check with the airplane reservation things, and
he told him to wait for some time. And we don’t have any money or we don’t have any
dollar with us; and my daughter was crying because she was so hungry and she was
crying so loud. The trip was okay, but we have a problem in Germany and nobody can
help us.
MO: Did you come to Salt Lake – were you assigned to Salt Lake?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: We were in Maryland.
MO: And then from Maryland to Salt Lake?
KG: We were assigned in Maryland.
MO: So you haven’t transferred, or you’re still technically assigned?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: They were assigned in Maryland, then they moved to Utah.
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MO: That’s a big difference.
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: Yeah.
[Laughter]
MO: You’re probably more comfortable here because we have so much farming, and
Maryland doesn’t have anything?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: He said I like this place.
MO: Yeah, I think I like it a lot more too.
[Laughter]
KG: [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KGI: I like agriculture, so I was happy when I moved to this place.
MO: Good. How long were you in Maryland?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: I was in Maryland for eight months and some days.
MO: What did you do for work?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: He was working in Lancaster Food Company – they were packing vegetables.
MO: Okay. And did you come to Utah because you heard about JBS?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
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[46:18]
KGI: Okay. I heard about JBS, even I had that work that company he was working in
Lancaster, it’s all the way in Utah (he didn’t know exactly where), but it’s somewhere
around here. And besides that, they told me this is kind of rural area, not big metropolitan
city like Maryland. Since I was raised on a farm I try to be close to farm, so that’s why I
moved here.
MO: Okay. There was something I was going to ask – I have to remember it. Oh, I am curious
about what you thought living in Eritrea, what the expectation is of what Americans are
like, and how did that change?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: When I was in Eritrea, I didn’t know enough about America (I just know America is a
good place to live and a great country). When I come I was worried because as far as I
figured America in my brain it was just big metropolitan area – I didn’t even know
America has farmlands and rural areas. And when I come first, the first city I saw was big
so many buildings on it; I was worried, “What I’m going to do in this country? How I’m
going to live?” I don’t know any language, I don’t have education. But when I saw it’s
okay, I can survive and the [??] has everything. But my expectation and what I found is
so different; I was thinking about big buildings and metropolitan areas, but there are a lot
of rural and farm areas too.
MO: That’s good; it’s good that we have farms.
[Laughter]
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[50:22]
KGI: He say we are processing a lot of [??] in our brain because we are told this is hard
country to live – even people will tell you that you can get lost inside America and
nobody is going to find you. Even when I was coming from Maryland to Utah some
people told me, “You’re going to get lost,” even I was scared I might get lost in between,
so nobody is going to find me. But everything is [??] I’m told about in America – even if
I get lost if I got some offices they come bring me a translator. So it’s a good country and
everything is arranged.
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MO: Good, because I think a lot of Americans want to get lost, but we don’t feel like we can
because our government keeps pretty good track of us.
[Laughter]
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: They don’t get lost.
[Laughter]
MO: I’m not worried about you – if you can live on a farm, you deserve the right of being in
the U.S. I think.
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Now I can figure it out, even I cannot get lost in big cities because there are ways he can
communicate with others.
MO: Absolutely. So when you moved from Maryland to Utah, did the government help you in
any way?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, when he moved he didn’t get any help. He just worked and he paid his travel
expense with the money we saved. But when he was moving he took the agency who
helped them, because he had so many medical papers (he got surgery on his) –
[Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: He got surgery on his left eye, so they collected all his paperwork and other medical
records. And they gave all their paperwork to him, and he just moved with his own
money.
MO: Did you know anyone in Logan, or did you just sort of come in and find a place to live
and work?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
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KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah there were some people I know who live here; even my girlfriend – she first moved
here because she got her brothers here, and then I just followed her. If we don’t know
anyone we cannot move, because we cannot move in a place we don’t know anything.
MO: Um-hmm. So you have a lot of friends, and even relatives here – do you feel included by
the rest of the community?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[55:37]
KGI: I don’t feel isolated from the community because they help us with anything we ask of
them, even sometimes when we come first I just have the address in my hand but I cannot
look at my apartment – I ask them, “Hey, do you know where this address is?” Some of
them they just show me, but there are some good people that just took me until I reached
the address I am looking for. So these people are loving people and they are good people.
MO: Is there anything that we could do to help you feel more at home?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: I can’t ask for more because there is work opportunity, other stuff, but I prefer to have a
farmland to make my own farm – I don’t want to work in JBS forever because I have eye
problem sometimes it’s kind of hard for me to work the whole day. I have nowhere to
ask, but if possible I would like to have a farm and do my own farm.
MO: That’s the American Dream.
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
MO: Every American wants to have a farm [laughing].
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: It’s a good dream; even I want to have a farm – that’s my field.
MO: Yeah, I think it makes you a good American [laughing] to have that dream.
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MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
[Laughter]
MO: So you have five kids still in Africa?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, they are in Africa.
MO: Are you going to try to bring them to the United States?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[59:30]
KGI: Yeah, I would love to bring them here, but the problem is how can they leave Eritrea?
We cross the border, but they are too young to cross the border – they might have a lot of
problems, they need an adult to take them out. The older one and his younger brother,
they are already out in the refugee camp, but for the rest of them: they are too young to
cross the border. So he is trying to figure out how they can retrieve them, get Visas for
them.
MO: The three you have here, are they in school or are they too young?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: The younger one is younger (he was just born in United States) –
KG: [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KGI: The older one, she goes to KG[??] here – I don’t know but he was telling me the school
somewhere around 300 North 300 West?
MO: Okay.
KGI: She goes there – the older one of the three; but the younger one is only two months old.
MO: So not even talking yet? [Laughs]
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MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: The youngest is too young – not talking, but the other one is older –
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: He is an American before I am.
[Laughter]
MO: Speaks English and everything?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[Laughter]
KGI: Yeah, he talks English.
[Laughter]
MO: Good. How are the experiences with your landlord? Are you in an apartment?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah.
[Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, he lives in an apartment and he doesn’t have any problem with his landlord.
MO: What would you like people in Logan to know about you and your community?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
[End part 1 of 2 – 62:06]
[Part 2 of 2 – 00:01]
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MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: He said most of us in Logan we are here from villages in Eritrea: when we come, we
came from rural areas (there are some who came from the cities). So we don’t know a lot
of stuff because we are new and we are born in farm areas and sometimes we need help –
[Phone ringing]
We need help how to figure out how things work here, and sometimes I wish if the city
can give us some farmland in something that grows because we are good in farm. I prefer
to work in a farm with some of my community [??]. And we also need education – we’ve
got children and we need education for us and for our children.
MO: Um-hmm. Are the English classes helping then? Are you able to find any other – or what
kind of education do you need?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[02:58]
KGI: There is English school – that’s good, but sometimes it’s kind of far for us (some of us
who don’t have cars), and sometimes we work in JBS this hard work all over and
spending day in JBS and going to school is kind of hard. So if possible if they do it on the
weekends it would be better, because we don’t have anything to do on the weekends – we
can go there and study.
MO: Okay; that would be a good idea.
KGI: Um-hmm.
MO: Would you ever go back home?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, I have a lot of family over there, but I would not go over there – I don’t think I can
go there. I love living here.
MO: Okay. What are you most proud of?
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MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: I am proud I can work and even myself because it’s not good to ask help every time from
other people or other organizations. And I’m proud I am healthy, except I have problems
with my eye; but I can work, I am healthy. And I am proud I have children with me here
in the United States. And I am proud I am living here.
MO: To own a farm is the ultimate dream?
[05:07]
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yes, his dream is to own a farm. [Laughs]
MO: Okay, well if you have a farm in America, you have to get a cowboy hat.
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: Okay.
[Laughter]
MO: So that should be a dream too, to own a cowboy hat.
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
[Laughter]
MO: Do you have any other dreams?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah I have a lot of dreams, but I will do it one by one; we will see in the future – for
example, I want to own my own house (I don’t want to live in apartments forever). It’s a
good idea to own house first.
MO: Um-hmm; good. Well those are all the questions I have. So do you have any questions for
us, or does anyone else have any questions?
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MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Do you guys have any questions? No?
??: Have you heard about the garden that Nelda has?
??I: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
??: The refugee garden?
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[07:40]
KGI: There were a couple of guys who talked to Nelda about farm –
??: Um-hmm?
KGI: And she send them to another lady named Jillian (he guess, or something like that). So
she got an appointment to meet somewhere and to discuss about it, but they didn’t make
it – they were mis-communicated about the appointment place or time. After that they
didn’t hear anything about that.
??: Well hopefully that can happen.
MO: That’s everything. I think we’re going to conclude this interview. We want to thank you
again for meeting with us and telling us a little bit about, I don’t know, your life.
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[09:23]
KGI: Okay. I don’t know whether you guys can answer this question: but he was saying in this
country they tell us you cannot punish your child, and children – they make a lot of [??]
and a lot of [??] stuff and you cannot [??] them. If you do not [??] them, they go worse
and worse and worse. So if you don’t [??] them, how can you correct them? Back home
when children get mistakes or they do something bad, we punish them accordingly.
MO: Um-hmm?
KGI: So when we come here we don’t know anything and they told us we cannot punish our
children – they do lot of crazy stuff and nonsense stuff, and we just look at them because
we cannot punish them. So he wants to know, can we punish our children or not?
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MO: That is a great debate.
[Laughter]
If you ask my dad, you can discipline your kids – but make sure that they know that you
still love them.
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: In Eritrea my children – Eritrea is a good country, but when my children make mistakes, I
punish them and they know why they are punished. Even if I punish them they love me
and they know I love them, because they are my children.
??: And I would suggest, because I know that my friend – because you could get in trouble
like if you – it is kind of crazy here. Like if they’re doing something naughty in the store,
she’ll take them out to her car, or she’ll take them when she gets home. So I think in your
home, then no one can say anything.
MO: You don’t want – it’s interesting; discipline in America is very different, it’s very
interesting because it is such a big debate.
MOI: [Repeating the statements in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[13:03]
KGI: Even back home we just don’t – kids, if we hit them we don’t hit them in front of other
people; we just tell them what they did mistakes and we punish accordingly (sometimes
we can take stuff they have, the stuff they play with or other things – it depends what
they got). But here is kind of hard.
MO: Well I think that’s how you should do it.
??: So you’re doing it right, if you do it.
MOI: [Repeating the statements in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: He is saying if we don’t punish our children, what are you raising – some of them they
will not go to school, some of them will be thieves or other stuff. And the worst thing I
hate is prostitution – I don’t want my children to be that. Because if I don’t [??] them, if I
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don’t talk to them they are not going to know what is right and what’s wrong. So he say I
just want to know whether I can punish and discipline my children.
MO: I say yes.
KG: [Laughs] [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[Laughter]
MO: Well we are going to at least stop the recording here, but just a final question: you are
okay if we use this and put it in the archives, and use it for educational purposes?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, I don’t have any problem; you can put it. This is what happened to my lives, it’s a
very important thing. And I don’t have anything to hide – I tell you what the real thing is.
It’s not political; the only thing I hate is politics. So I’m okay if you guys put it in the
archive.
MO: Okay. And online too?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: No problem.
MO: Okay; thank you.
KG: You’re welcome.
MO: Thank you, thank you.
[End part 2 of 2 – 16:28]
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CACHE VALLEY REFUGEE ORAL HISTORY PROJECT
TRANSCRIPTION COVER SHEET
Interviewee(s): Kahsaoy Berhe Gebremedhin
Present: Magen Olsen, Kahsaoy Berhe Gebremedhin, Berhane, Hilary Warner-
Evans, Heidi Williams
Place of Interview:
Date of Interview: May 23, 2015
Language(s): Tigrinya
Translation:
Interviewer: Magen Olsen
Interpreter: Berhane
Recordist: Heidi Williams
Photographer: Hilary Warner-Evans
Recording Equipment: Tascam DR-100mk11 linear PCM recorder; Senal ENG-18RL
broadcast-quality omnidirectional dynamic microphone
Transcription Equipment: Express Scribe with PowerPlayer foot pedal.
Transcribed by: Susan Gross, May 26, 2015
Transcript Proofed by:
Brief Description of Contents: Mr. Kahsaoy Berhe Gebremedhin talks about his life in Eritrea,
his family, and escaping to Ethiopia as a refugee. He talks about his time spent at Shimelba
refugee camp in Ethiopia, and the process he followed to come to the United States as a refugee.
He discusses life in America, his current job and his dream to have a farm.
Reference: MO = Magen Olsen
MOI = Magen Olsen’s words interpreted by translator
KG = Kahsaoy Berhe Gebremedhin
KGI = Kahsaoy Berhe Gebremedhin’s words interpreted by translator
NOTE: [You will have to modify this as appropriate—whether using CommGap or in-person
interpreter.] The interview was conducted with CommGap Interpretive Services; the interpreter
joined the interview via a cell phone. False starts, pauses, or transitions in dialogue such as “uh”
and starts and stops in conversations are not included in transcript. All additions and added
information to transcript are noted with brackets.
TAPE TRANSCRIPTION
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[Part 1 of 2 – 00:01]
MO: Alright; we are here, it is – of course we are here – it is Saturday [laughing], ten o’clock
in the morning, May 23rd, 2015. It’s raining today for about the 100th day –
??: In a row.
MO: [Laughing] It seems like it’s been rainy every, single day. We are here with Kahsaoy,
right?
KG: Yes.
MO: Who is a refugee from Eritrea; translating for him is Berhane. We have Hilary Warner-
Evans on the photography end of things, and Heidi Williams is recording and taking
some notes. And we’re going to go ahead and start.
So how are you doing today?
KG: Good.
MO: Good, good. Thanks for meeting with us, and for being willing to talk with us and share
some things about your experiences as a refugee, living in the United States.
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: Thank you.
MO: So we’ll start with the first question is what is your full name and birth year?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: His name is Kahsaoy Berhe Gebremedhin; he was born in 1971.
MO: Okay. What languages do you speak?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: Tigrinya.
MO: That’s it?
KGI: He speaks Tigrinya.
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KG: Yes.
MO: Perfect. And tell me about your family?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Okay. [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: I have three children here, in America, and I got five more back in Eritrea. I have one
brother here, in America, and I have six siblings back home.
MO: So do they – your family members – they all live here (who are in America)?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, yeah.
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, three of them they are here (the youngest ones) –
KG: [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KGI: But he got five more in Africa, two of them are in the Ethiopia refugee camp – the rest
three are in Eritrea.
[03:28]
MO: So that’s got to be hard, being all over?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, it’s still hard because people are everywhere; even it’s hard for me – some of them,
they are in the refugee camp, there is nothing over there – I have to send them money to
support family there. It’s kind of hard.
MO: What religion are you?
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MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: He is Eritrean Orthodox Church.
MO: Okay, good. Can you tell me a bit about Eritrea, where you’re from?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Eritrea is a good place to live, but there is some problem – [speaking in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah; he says it’s harder to [??] stuff it has to do with farming, and we don’t have a lot
and we don’t know anything about the life in the cities. So generally, the economy [??]
MO: Did you grow up on a farm then?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, they are all from –
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Farmer.
MO: What did you grow – animals, grain?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[06:20]
KGI: We raise grains – we don’t have any technology, we plow the field by oxes; and when it
comes to harvesting season, we harvest it manually and with the help of animals. And we
also have animal harvest[??].
MO: Okay. So did you live in the – Berhane has talked about highlands and lowlands – did
you live in the highlands or the lowlands?
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MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: He was living in the lowlands.
MO: Cool. How long did you live there? So how long have you been in the U.S., I guess?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: He has been in American almost a year and eight months.
MO: Good.
KG: 2013.
KGI: He came here on 2013.
MO: Cool. Why did you leave Eritrea?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: I was in the National Service [??] army, and I have a lot of children – nobody supporting
them behind me, and he is not getting anything. Finally he get frustrated and left Eritrea
with the refugee camp in Ethiopia.
MO: And when did you do that?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: Refugee – 2007.
KGI: 2007.
KG: Yeah.
MO: So six years in Ethiopia?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
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KGI: Yeah, six years and some couple of months.
KG: [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, he went there on July 15, 2007 – [speaking in Tigrinya to the interviewee]
[09:20]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.] 2013 –
KGI: [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
And he came here on September 2013.
KG: [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KGI: On the 18th of September, 2013. So, do your calc –
[Laughter]
MO: I will once –
KGI: It’s easier to do once –
MO: Yeah, if you’re already there –
[Laughing]
So you’re in science, and we’re all in [laughs] folklore.
KG: [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, six years two months and three days.
MO: Perfect.
KGI: [??]
[Laughter]
MO: Two months, three days.
So what was the experience like in leaving?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
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KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, I don’t have any problem because I was born there, I know the whole land and we
got farms in between. There was army soldiers in the trench, but sometimes they just
don’t care because we go back and forth for our animals and farms; and he went to his
brother and didn’t get any problem – he just crossed.
MO: It’s hard for other people then, right (usually)?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: For me it was easy because I was raised in the rural areas, and we got animals so we cross
all over the place (because our animals for food and water to the animals). But for some
people who came from the capital or from the highlands – they didn’t know the area,
even we are raised differently (maybe they cannot hike a lot). Sometimes they don’t
know the land, they just go directly to the army, they get captured, and god knows what
they do with them. But for me it was easy; but for some people it’s a lot harder.
MO: That makes sense. So you relocated first to Ethiopia, right?
[12:37]
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, from Eritrea he relocated to the Shimelba refugee camps in Ethiopia – the camp
name is Shimelba. Do you want to spell?
MO: Yeah.
[Laughter]
KGI: S-H-I-M-L-B-A. Shimelba. So he relocated from Eritrea to the refugee camp in Ethiopia.
MO: And then did you go to any other refugee camps?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: From that refugee camp he directly came to the United States.
MO: Okay. What was your experience like in that camp?
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MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: It was kind of okay for me because I was raised in rural area, and that place was a rural
area. And since I was raised working with my family, in that refugee camp I was allowed
to work; I was working, earning money. So for me it was not [??]; it was kind of okay.
MO: But it would be hard for people from the capital, maybe?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[15:43]
KGI: For some people it was hard because we were getting only 15 kilos of weight (around 30
pounds), and I was raised in a rural area around that area, so it was okay for me – I can go
and work, communicate with the people because they got the same behavior[??]. But the
refugee in the [??], they tend not to leave the camp – if you leave the camp it’s all your
responsibility if something happens, so some people they get scared; but for me, it’s okay
just leave and work – clear my mind and then come back. So some people they don’t
want to leave the camp, some people they don’t know how to work in the farm. So you
can’t [??] with the 15 kilos of weight; if you are lucky, if you have families in the U.S. or
England, they ask for money or for help. But there were a lot of people struggling in that
camp.
MO: Did they have small houses for you, or how was the living situation?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah most of the times they don’t give us houses; for his case he get a plot of land – most
of the time they give them a plot of land, you have to make your own house. Even for
him they didn’t give him a plot of land, there was some of his friends (they have their
own plot of land, they give it to him – he build his own house. He don’t know if they
made houses for the first arrival refugees (because the refugee camp starts a couple of
years before he arrived). He hears they help some women if they got problems, maybe
children or other stuff; but if you are a man, they don’t give you anything – they just give
you a plot of land: you have to make your own house.
MO: So did you arrive by yourself and then some of your family came after?
[18:38]
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MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: I cross the border with my brother – he has three children here – he met a woman over
there, he get married with her in the refugee camp, and then she came here.
MO: Okay.
KGI: Only he made his house –
KG: [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KGI: And now they are not even married, they are friends.
MO: Okay. Is she still there, or is she here?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: She is here.
MO: Okay, good. Were you assigned a job, or did you kind of find one on your own?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: In my case I was going out to the farmers near the camp, and ask the job from them –
they can give you farm work, or construction – not big construction, but he just make
some building walls and things like that – I do whatever I find. But there are some people
they are educated [??] they work with [??] the camp, or something with the refugee
administration. But for him, he was going to farmers and ask for a job.
MO: Okay. How did you celebrate holidays in your camp?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[21:39]
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KGI: Because it’s the same culture, so we have everything what we can have in Eritrea; with
whatever we got we make injera, we make soya (soya is a local drink in Eritrea), and we
kill a goat, and we celebrate.
MO: Is it easier – it’s probably easier, I shouldn’t even be asking this – it’s probably easier to
celebrate in the camp, then (your holidays), rather than in the U.S., right?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah he said in American you can find anything at the shopping centers, but some people
– they have money, they can afford it; but there are lot of them who cannot afford it. So it
is easier here in American than in the camp.
MO: Okay. Because you can’t go to Wal-Mart and buy a goat or a sheep [laughs].
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah you can buy meat over there.
[Laughter]
MO: That’s true. Well but we have farms, too, that you can go to and buy animals, right?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: Yeah [responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah there is an old man and a woman somewhere in this 600 South, they sell sheeps,
chickens – I always go there and buy goats. [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: And they got a place, and he kills a goat and takes the meat and sells it fresh over there.
MO: Good. They’re not worried about that or anything?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: They got a place for killing the sheep –
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MO: Um-hmm?
KGI: Even they show up, “Hey, you want to kill it – go kill it over there,” (to kill fresh stuff).
MO: Nice! That’s a good deal.
KG: Um-hmm [speaking in Tigrinya].
KGI: And they know us – when they see us they say, “Ah, it’s the guys who kill the goats.”
[Laughter]
KG: [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KGI: I know they don’t like us to kill the sheeps because they show us the place and they run
away to their apartment.
[Laughter]
[25:02]
MO: Yeah, I think it’s alarming for Americans to think that they would have to kill their own
animals; we just like to pretend that we’re not eating animals, I think.
KGI: Yeah. [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
[Laughter]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: I understand that.
[Laughter]
MO: I feel like the weird one, because it makes sense to take care of your own food like that.
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: So he said for us it’s very [??]: we want to take care of our own food, we feel comfortable
when we kill our sheep or goat. Sometimes it’s kind of hard to go to the shop and buy a
meat because you don’t know who killed the sheep. We are kind of strict in our religion
orthodox: you have to kill it yourself, you have to say, “By the name of God, Son, and the
Holy Spirit;” and we feel comfortable. Most of the time we eat only sheep or goat, so if
it’s other animal, hmm, we don’t feel comfortable (because we don’t eat pork).
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MO: That’s typically a Muslim –
KGI: If it’s Muslim they don’t eat it before we kill it.
MO: Oh, okay. But I mean that’s Old Law, right?
KGI: Yeah, it come from the Jews.
MO: Right.
KGI: Then the Muslim and the Christian, they are branches.
MO: Because I know with like Catholics and Protestants – they don’t have any problem eating
pork.
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[28:22]
KGI: Yeah, Islam – they have their own way; they are different from us. But if I go to Wal-
Mart and buy meat, I don’t know whether it’s a sheep’s meat, or it’s a donkey’s meat: it’s
just a meat, we don’t know. But according the way we are raised, and according to our
religion – if I kill it, I know it’s a sheep or a goat. So we feel comfortable if we kill our
sheep and goat (or other animals), and we know what we are killing, and we blessed it by
saying, “In the name of God, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.” So we feel comfortable if we
kill our own animals, rather than going to Wal-Mart and buying meat we don’t know.
MO: Do you feel safe in the camp?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: For me, I was not scared for my safety; I always go out of the camp, work in the field,
even sometime there are nights I spend my nights in the field. I am not a city boy – I was
raised in farm and all our thing is doing the fields and spending the nights with the
animals. So I didn’t have any problem, and I wasn’t scared because I don’t have any
crime, I don’t have [??]. But there might be some people, even I remember one person
who died in the fields – nobody knows who killed him; still nobody knows what
happened to that guy.
MO: Hmm. Did you feel welcomed by the Ethiopians? Because I know that you’re very
closely related.
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MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
[31:20]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: As long as I was over there I don’t have any problem. Even I don’t have any problem,
they always tell us not to leave the camp; if you leave the camp you are responsible for
what happen to you – and they are right, they cannot protect you out of the camp. But
with the people who are just going together, going along – we don’t have any problem.
But I heard when I come here there was some fight in the camp.
MO: Hmm. How did you learn about the U.S. refugee program?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: When I was crossing the border from Eritrea to Ethiopia, I didn’t have any idea about the
U.S. refugee program, I just knew I wanted when I went to the refugee camp.
KG: [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, when we crossed (me and my brother), we don’t know what was the refugee
program over there (even we didn’t know there was a camp). So when they crossed the
border, the people who give them – after they crossed Ethiopia they were talking to [??]
Amharic[?], but he don’t know Amharic[?], his brother knows a little bit of Hamari –
they were telling them, “You guys are going to Shimelba refugee camp, there are other
Eritreans over there. You guys will go to America.” And [??] says what is Amharic
talking about; but when they took them the refugee camp there were lots of Eritreans, and
they knew the refugee program to the United States from the other Eritreans who were in
the camp before them.
MO: Did they help you apply – because it sounds like they told you, you were going to go?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[36:22]
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KGI: Okay. When he crossed first the border the Ethiopian army, when they caught you they
took you to some place (they call it [??]), then they register, “Who are you guys? Where
do you come from?” Things like that. Then after they confirm they are from Eritrea and
things like that, they send them to Shimelba refugee camp. Then the Shimelba [??] the
refugee camp, they transfer all your paperwork with them, because these people in [??],
they ask them a lot of questions in their own office, they register them. So they send their
resume and their session papers refugee camp in Shimelba. In the Shimelba camp there
are a lot of organizations they put them. There is Ara[??], these Ara are the people who
gives them food – that means who gives them the food and other things. And there is a
UNCR – they process the papers for a refugee to United States.
[Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, this UNCR – they process their guys to U.S., Australia and Canada. But there is
not a lot of obligations things to do if you are in the country on the border, they put in
paperwork, the Ethiopian army or police [??] – they transfer all their papers Shimelba
refugee camp; after that you just wait for interview.
MO: So the process took six years? When did you interview?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[38:37]
KGI: Yeah, he is not sure about the months, but the interview was around 2010.
KG: [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KGI: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
He said I don’t remember the exact month, but I have my own record so maybe it’s in my
cards.
MO: It will be important for your kids and grandkids one day.
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: Yeah.
MO: Tell me about coming to the U.S. – what was it like?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
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KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[Conversation back and forth between Kahsaoy and Berhane in Tigrinya.]
[42:12]
KGI: Yeah, he said when they come here they got a problem transit in Germany –
[Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Transit in Frankfurt – so when they leave the airplane the IOM people (they are the
people who help with them with the airplane tickets, because they have to pay it back) –
one of the IOM came he took other people, but for us he told us, “Just number 57.” And
he said I don’t know anything about airports, even I don’t know anything about city life
so I don’t know where to find number 57. But finally I just found it, but when I go over
there I don’t know who to ask and I don’t know what to do. And we were struggling and
stressed out in that airport; finally I saw an Ethiopian guy (he speaks some Amharic), and
I talk to him. Then he went inside and he check with the airplane reservation things, and
he told him to wait for some time. And we don’t have any money or we don’t have any
dollar with us; and my daughter was crying because she was so hungry and she was
crying so loud. The trip was okay, but we have a problem in Germany and nobody can
help us.
MO: Did you come to Salt Lake – were you assigned to Salt Lake?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: We were in Maryland.
MO: And then from Maryland to Salt Lake?
KG: We were assigned in Maryland.
MO: So you haven’t transferred, or you’re still technically assigned?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: They were assigned in Maryland, then they moved to Utah.
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MO: That’s a big difference.
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: Yeah.
[Laughter]
MO: You’re probably more comfortable here because we have so much farming, and
Maryland doesn’t have anything?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: He said I like this place.
MO: Yeah, I think I like it a lot more too.
[Laughter]
KG: [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KGI: I like agriculture, so I was happy when I moved to this place.
MO: Good. How long were you in Maryland?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: I was in Maryland for eight months and some days.
MO: What did you do for work?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: He was working in Lancaster Food Company – they were packing vegetables.
MO: Okay. And did you come to Utah because you heard about JBS?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
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[46:18]
KGI: Okay. I heard about JBS, even I had that work that company he was working in
Lancaster, it’s all the way in Utah (he didn’t know exactly where), but it’s somewhere
around here. And besides that, they told me this is kind of rural area, not big metropolitan
city like Maryland. Since I was raised on a farm I try to be close to farm, so that’s why I
moved here.
MO: Okay. There was something I was going to ask – I have to remember it. Oh, I am curious
about what you thought living in Eritrea, what the expectation is of what Americans are
like, and how did that change?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: When I was in Eritrea, I didn’t know enough about America (I just know America is a
good place to live and a great country). When I come I was worried because as far as I
figured America in my brain it was just big metropolitan area – I didn’t even know
America has farmlands and rural areas. And when I come first, the first city I saw was big
so many buildings on it; I was worried, “What I’m going to do in this country? How I’m
going to live?” I don’t know any language, I don’t have education. But when I saw it’s
okay, I can survive and the [??] has everything. But my expectation and what I found is
so different; I was thinking about big buildings and metropolitan areas, but there are a lot
of rural and farm areas too.
MO: That’s good; it’s good that we have farms.
[Laughter]
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[50:22]
KGI: He say we are processing a lot of [??] in our brain because we are told this is hard
country to live – even people will tell you that you can get lost inside America and
nobody is going to find you. Even when I was coming from Maryland to Utah some
people told me, “You’re going to get lost,” even I was scared I might get lost in between,
so nobody is going to find me. But everything is [??] I’m told about in America – even if
I get lost if I got some offices they come bring me a translator. So it’s a good country and
everything is arranged.
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MO: Good, because I think a lot of Americans want to get lost, but we don’t feel like we can
because our government keeps pretty good track of us.
[Laughter]
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: They don’t get lost.
[Laughter]
MO: I’m not worried about you – if you can live on a farm, you deserve the right of being in
the U.S. I think.
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Now I can figure it out, even I cannot get lost in big cities because there are ways he can
communicate with others.
MO: Absolutely. So when you moved from Maryland to Utah, did the government help you in
any way?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, when he moved he didn’t get any help. He just worked and he paid his travel
expense with the money we saved. But when he was moving he took the agency who
helped them, because he had so many medical papers (he got surgery on his) –
[Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: He got surgery on his left eye, so they collected all his paperwork and other medical
records. And they gave all their paperwork to him, and he just moved with his own
money.
MO: Did you know anyone in Logan, or did you just sort of come in and find a place to live
and work?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
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KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah there were some people I know who live here; even my girlfriend – she first moved
here because she got her brothers here, and then I just followed her. If we don’t know
anyone we cannot move, because we cannot move in a place we don’t know anything.
MO: Um-hmm. So you have a lot of friends, and even relatives here – do you feel included by
the rest of the community?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[55:37]
KGI: I don’t feel isolated from the community because they help us with anything we ask of
them, even sometimes when we come first I just have the address in my hand but I cannot
look at my apartment – I ask them, “Hey, do you know where this address is?” Some of
them they just show me, but there are some good people that just took me until I reached
the address I am looking for. So these people are loving people and they are good people.
MO: Is there anything that we could do to help you feel more at home?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: I can’t ask for more because there is work opportunity, other stuff, but I prefer to have a
farmland to make my own farm – I don’t want to work in JBS forever because I have eye
problem sometimes it’s kind of hard for me to work the whole day. I have nowhere to
ask, but if possible I would like to have a farm and do my own farm.
MO: That’s the American Dream.
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
MO: Every American wants to have a farm [laughing].
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: It’s a good dream; even I want to have a farm – that’s my field.
MO: Yeah, I think it makes you a good American [laughing] to have that dream.
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MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
[Laughter]
MO: So you have five kids still in Africa?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, they are in Africa.
MO: Are you going to try to bring them to the United States?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[59:30]
KGI: Yeah, I would love to bring them here, but the problem is how can they leave Eritrea?
We cross the border, but they are too young to cross the border – they might have a lot of
problems, they need an adult to take them out. The older one and his younger brother,
they are already out in the refugee camp, but for the rest of them: they are too young to
cross the border. So he is trying to figure out how they can retrieve them, get Visas for
them.
MO: The three you have here, are they in school or are they too young?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: The younger one is younger (he was just born in United States) –
KG: [Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KGI: The older one, she goes to KG[??] here – I don’t know but he was telling me the school
somewhere around 300 North 300 West?
MO: Okay.
KGI: She goes there – the older one of the three; but the younger one is only two months old.
MO: So not even talking yet? [Laughs]
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MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: The youngest is too young – not talking, but the other one is older –
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: He is an American before I am.
[Laughter]
MO: Speaks English and everything?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[Laughter]
KGI: Yeah, he talks English.
[Laughter]
MO: Good. How are the experiences with your landlord? Are you in an apartment?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah.
[Speaking in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, he lives in an apartment and he doesn’t have any problem with his landlord.
MO: What would you like people in Logan to know about you and your community?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
[End part 1 of 2 – 62:06]
[Part 2 of 2 – 00:01]
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MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: He said most of us in Logan we are here from villages in Eritrea: when we come, we
came from rural areas (there are some who came from the cities). So we don’t know a lot
of stuff because we are new and we are born in farm areas and sometimes we need help –
[Phone ringing]
We need help how to figure out how things work here, and sometimes I wish if the city
can give us some farmland in something that grows because we are good in farm. I prefer
to work in a farm with some of my community [??]. And we also need education – we’ve
got children and we need education for us and for our children.
MO: Um-hmm. Are the English classes helping then? Are you able to find any other – or what
kind of education do you need?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[02:58]
KGI: There is English school – that’s good, but sometimes it’s kind of far for us (some of us
who don’t have cars), and sometimes we work in JBS this hard work all over and
spending day in JBS and going to school is kind of hard. So if possible if they do it on the
weekends it would be better, because we don’t have anything to do on the weekends – we
can go there and study.
MO: Okay; that would be a good idea.
KGI: Um-hmm.
MO: Would you ever go back home?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, I have a lot of family over there, but I would not go over there – I don’t think I can
go there. I love living here.
MO: Okay. What are you most proud of?
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MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: I am proud I can work and even myself because it’s not good to ask help every time from
other people or other organizations. And I’m proud I am healthy, except I have problems
with my eye; but I can work, I am healthy. And I am proud I have children with me here
in the United States. And I am proud I am living here.
MO: To own a farm is the ultimate dream?
[05:07]
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yes, his dream is to own a farm. [Laughs]
MO: Okay, well if you have a farm in America, you have to get a cowboy hat.
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: Okay.
[Laughter]
MO: So that should be a dream too, to own a cowboy hat.
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
[Laughter]
MO: Do you have any other dreams?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah I have a lot of dreams, but I will do it one by one; we will see in the future – for
example, I want to own my own house (I don’t want to live in apartments forever). It’s a
good idea to own house first.
MO: Um-hmm; good. Well those are all the questions I have. So do you have any questions for
us, or does anyone else have any questions?
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MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Do you guys have any questions? No?
??: Have you heard about the garden that Nelda has?
??I: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
??: The refugee garden?
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[07:40]
KGI: There were a couple of guys who talked to Nelda about farm –
??: Um-hmm?
KGI: And she send them to another lady named Jillian (he guess, or something like that). So
she got an appointment to meet somewhere and to discuss about it, but they didn’t make
it – they were mis-communicated about the appointment place or time. After that they
didn’t hear anything about that.
??: Well hopefully that can happen.
MO: That’s everything. I think we’re going to conclude this interview. We want to thank you
again for meeting with us and telling us a little bit about, I don’t know, your life.
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[09:23]
KGI: Okay. I don’t know whether you guys can answer this question: but he was saying in this
country they tell us you cannot punish your child, and children – they make a lot of [??]
and a lot of [??] stuff and you cannot [??] them. If you do not [??] them, they go worse
and worse and worse. So if you don’t [??] them, how can you correct them? Back home
when children get mistakes or they do something bad, we punish them accordingly.
MO: Um-hmm?
KGI: So when we come here we don’t know anything and they told us we cannot punish our
children – they do lot of crazy stuff and nonsense stuff, and we just look at them because
we cannot punish them. So he wants to know, can we punish our children or not?
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MO: That is a great debate.
[Laughter]
If you ask my dad, you can discipline your kids – but make sure that they know that you
still love them.
MOI: [Repeating the statement in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: In Eritrea my children – Eritrea is a good country, but when my children make mistakes, I
punish them and they know why they are punished. Even if I punish them they love me
and they know I love them, because they are my children.
??: And I would suggest, because I know that my friend – because you could get in trouble
like if you – it is kind of crazy here. Like if they’re doing something naughty in the store,
she’ll take them out to her car, or she’ll take them when she gets home. So I think in your
home, then no one can say anything.
MO: You don’t want – it’s interesting; discipline in America is very different, it’s very
interesting because it is such a big debate.
MOI: [Repeating the statements in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[13:03]
KGI: Even back home we just don’t – kids, if we hit them we don’t hit them in front of other
people; we just tell them what they did mistakes and we punish accordingly (sometimes
we can take stuff they have, the stuff they play with or other things – it depends what
they got). But here is kind of hard.
MO: Well I think that’s how you should do it.
??: So you’re doing it right, if you do it.
MOI: [Repeating the statements in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: He is saying if we don’t punish our children, what are you raising – some of them they
will not go to school, some of them will be thieves or other stuff. And the worst thing I
hate is prostitution – I don’t want my children to be that. Because if I don’t [??] them, if I
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don’t talk to them they are not going to know what is right and what’s wrong. So he say I
just want to know whether I can punish and discipline my children.
MO: I say yes.
KG: [Laughs] [Responding in Tigrinya.]
[Laughter]
MO: Well we are going to at least stop the recording here, but just a final question: you are
okay if we use this and put it in the archives, and use it for educational purposes?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: Yeah, I don’t have any problem; you can put it. This is what happened to my lives, it’s a
very important thing. And I don’t have anything to hide – I tell you what the real thing is.
It’s not political; the only thing I hate is politics. So I’m okay if you guys put it in the
archive.
MO: Okay. And online too?
MOI: [Repeating the question in Tigrinya.]
KG: [Responding in Tigrinya.]
KGI: No problem.
MO: Okay; thank you.
KG: You’re welcome.
MO: Thank you, thank you.
[End part 2 of 2 – 16:28]
Source
Utah State University, Merrill-Cazier Library, Special Collections and Archives, Cache Valley Refugee Oral History Project, FOLK COLL 60
Date
2015-05-23
Rights
Reproduction for publication, exhibition, web display or commercial use is only permissible with the consent of the USU Special Collections and Archives, phone (435) 797-2663;
Relation
Cache Valley Refugee Oral History Project
An inventory for this collection can be found at : http://nwda.orbiscascade.org/ark:/80444/xv67610
Cache Valley Refugee Oral History Project Digital Collection
Language
Type
Identifier
http://digital.lib.usu.edu/cdm/ref/collection/p16944coll14/id/95
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